Have had the 7270 with good results but the best SS was an Aaron from the Sovereign guy from Germany.Even a little better than Ayre.Really good.See him at hifi.net...cheers,Bob |
anybody likes Mcintosh with Merlins ?
|
The Bent/RM10/9 is anything but thin, that word does not cross my mind. The RM9 is a little warmer than the 10, but they are very much the work of the same designer, now 162 watts (on my RM9 SE) or (125 watts on the standard RM9 is still quite a bit more power than 35 watts and I imagine with certain kinds of music (orchestral?)you might notice that power difference - I don't notice it at all on jazz, which is mostly what I listen to. The best AVC? Bent Tap - nothing better in terms of ergonomics, volume control, remote convenience, but I would imagine it would be very similar sonically to some of the other Slagle-centric AVCs, one sold by Dave Slagle directly.... I think I am going to buy one again - the RM10 and a passive just work so well together. Just tried the Goldpoint Attenuator and remebered why I liked passives so much to begin with. Now I will try the Lightspeed Attenuator and a Bent Tap-X. Clio9 has tried both and finds them to be very close in sound, I think the Bent, based on his description sound like it might be a bit warmer, but he isn't using Merlins. |
Pubul 57'
Thank you for a very informative post. I am positive I would love AVC with RM10MKII. One reason to get Merlin was its resolution and transparency and extremely neutral character. Coming from Quad 989 and OTL amplifiers (..very transparent by nature), I am encouraged to hear about AVC/RM combo's transparency (..I guess more of good thing). TG audio speaker cables are slightly on the warmer side and I think would balance the sound overall. One big plus going a properly designed AVC route is attaining pitch black soundstage and excellent low level dynamics. One question though is, compared to ARS, do you find AVC/RM combo "thin" sounding? Also, any opinion on RM9 vs RM10? Also, which AVC preamp in your opinion is superior?
Again appreciate your insight into AVCs and Merlins. Thanks. |
I think the balanced connection is of very minimal, if any benefit, and I don't think you can get an AVC that is balanced - though it can be built at much greater expense. So far, my test have told me that AVC is better than TVC, that is I think the Bent with Slagle is better than my experience with S&B MK1 tranformers.
The Ars is warmer than the RM10MKII, more meat on the bone as they say, and it is a beautiful looking unit. Ultimately, I preferred the transparency and speed of the RM10MKII - can't say which is better, it is a matter of taste. What I like about the RM10, besides sound is that it is small, uses almost no power in idle, the tubes are cheap, and the run for 10,000 hours according to Roger - you also get to play with different preamps. The darn thing works awfully well with a passive pre - Roger sells a Pot-in-the-Box with some old Noble potentiometers for $135!!!, but it would certainly work great with the Bent. I was out of the passive scene for a while, but tried the Goldpoint again and realized the passives with the right amp are incredible, I've decided to play with some more upscale passives including the Lightspeed and I suspect Bent or an Slagle variant again - the Music Reference amps thrive on passives with there low sensitivity. For $1,300 (Passive with a used RM10, you would have one heck of a good sounding system. -Better than the Ars? that is a matter of taste, the Ars is certainly a very, very good integrated. |
I have an ARS Filarmonia and love it. I don't have a ton of experience with tube amplifiers, but the combination of this little amp plus the VSM-MMe's with Master BAM and RC's sounds amazing to me. I hear solid-state-like speed and authority combined with the refinement of tubes. Plus, I love the fact that it's small and doesn't get too hot. |
SsTalwar,
See this thread for a robust, detailed and full exchange on the MasterBam and Master RC networks with the remarkable Duelund caps.
http://forum.audiogon.com/cgi-bin/fr.pl?cspkr&1260044200&&&/Anyone-using-Duelund-VSF-capacitor-in-Me
Jim |
Turboglo,
I bought a used pair that came with Super BAM (RCA and XLR). I guess I am going to listen to my system so I can have my reference established and then compare to Master BAM in future. Right now debating between ARS and separates and some decent cables. Bobby did mention that Master BAM (RCA only for lack of space in chassis) with Master networks will take VSMs to a whole different level. In the hind sight, I still wonder if I could use XLR with certain Pre amps more successfully than RCA. I wonder if TVC or AVC preamps might benefit from XLR ... may be more experienced members using TVC/AVC can help. Also, anybody with MasterBAM experience? I am curious too about what the sonic impressions are compared to SuperBAM. |
Sstalwar, congratulations! Once I discovered the VSM's, I was done with my speaker search. Can't imagine you'll be disappointed. Just wondering, did you order your speakers with the Master BAM? The Duelund caps blow the whole thing to a new level. |
'57,
Thanks for the input. I suppose both used ARS and used Bent-Tap/RM10MKII combo are with in my reach. I missed one ARS sold on audiogon for $2k. Any opinion between the two..
Also, curious if Bent Tap could work with Transcendent OTL. I loved OTL with Quad989s and have learnt that Merlins work very well with OTL.
To start with, I have picked up a used TG Audio speaker cables which I guess is not widely popular among Merlin'ers, but read few people using this with Merlins and find it very musical..will see! Any recommendations on reasonably priced interconnects and PCs. |
I'm still waiting for them. I'm thinking 6-8 weeks more. |
'57,
What are your thoughts on the Master Bam/RC's? |
Love Bent-TAP, but not with Atma-sphere, the amp is not sensitive enough for a passive IMHO. What does work really well is a passive with the Music Reference RM10MKII ($1950 new, to $1,000 used). I had CAT JL2, Ars Sonum, Quicksilver, Music Reference RM9 & 10, and Pass XA30.5 and Aleph J with the MXe. To my ears, nothing beats the Atma-sphere M60s with the Atma-pre, but for a lot less money the RM10MKII is one hell of a great amp and it drives the Merlins beautifully with its 35 watts. If cash is no problem, Atma-sphere M60s with the MP3 is a world class combo with the Merlins (some prefer the Joule, but I think that is a matter of preference, and quite a bit more expensive than the Atma-sphere combo - though I do use a Joule LA150MKI Signature with my MR RM9s. |
Bought the Merlin VSM MXe speakers... Not received yet but very excited about the purchase. Firstly would like to thank all the members who guided me make the decision. Also, want to thank Bobby @ Merlin for spending time with me about related equipment matching etc. Picked up used Audio Aero Prima MK II CDP mainly at Bobby's rec. Would like to pair a TVC passive preamplifier (Bent Audio Tap X comes to mind) and an OTL amp (Atma or Transcendent sound). Other option is ARS integrated as we all know is also highly recommended by Bobby. Chime in with your thoughts....while I wait to set these up.. |
Sstalwar: One more thing: Upon reading your original post again, I realized that you were not clear if you were interested in Merlin TSM or VSM speakers. I had assumed that you were interested in the TSM speaker since you were considering the smaller Focal speakers. If you are indeed considering the Merlin VSM speakers, I have no experience with them but would certainly think they would be fine for orchestral music. So, please take my earlier comment about the TSM to be strictly limited to that speaker.
If I were considering speakers in the VSM price category, then I would certainly put the Silverline Bolero Supreme on my audition list. |
Sstalwar,
I wanted to add that the reason I suggested Silverline is that in an earlier post someone had suggested Dynaudio speakers to you, and Silverline makes excellent use of Dynaudio drivers. |
Sstalwar,
I've owned Merlin TSM speakers and loved them for jazz but not so much for orchestral music. I switched to Silverline SR17.5's and am very pleased with how they handle both genres. The more current Silverline model is the Silverline SR17 Supreme which lists for $6000. That's more than the Merlin TSM's, but less than the Micro Utopia - if I am thinking of the correct Focal speaker. If the Silverline is available in your area, you might want to add them to your audition list.
Also, my amplifiers are Rogue Audio M180 monoblocks which I run in triode. I am very happy Silverline/Rogue combination. |
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Not to stray off topic but does anyone have any input or experience as to how well the Merlin TSM's match with a Vincent SV236 MkII Hybrid Integrated? |
I'm glad I was/we were able to influence you. |
Pubul57- Hard to move back to the solid state sound when your a tube guy as am I;my roland 6's for me come very close;I would like to hear that solid state amp Ralph mentions now and then in the forums the name escapes me this moment though. |
Thank you Bobby. I do suspect you're right:) |
paul, audio aero made a 50w class a tube power amp. i heard it and it was superb. not made any longer. juicey and dynamic as could be. 30 to 50 watts of class a tranformer coupled or otl amps are as much as i would need for my home or even to do a show. 50 being better for more complex material or show conditions.
the bel is fantastic but i still prefer tubes and you probably would too.
best, b |
One of the reasons I think the Aleph J should in theory be a good match for the Merlins is that in many ways it performs like tubes in that it seems to not increase current (watts) with lower impedance, that is it performs more like tube amps in that regard. It also has a 260kohm input impedance which makes it very tube preamp friendly, which I think is best suited for the BAM, and with 30 watts of Class A power it should be enough to drive the Merlins about as loud as I could stand. This ofcourse is all theory, and does not mean it will work better than the BEL, Belles, or ARC 100.2 |
The ARC 100.2 sounds good with my TSM's. It is a great amp that can be found on the gon used for between 1500 and 1700. Years ago I had Pass ALeph and the 100.2 was more to my liking. |
paul, i think that you have a speaker that allows you to hear what good tube electronics sound like. your speaker also does not need the damping that ss amps provide in the bass. they prefer the dimensionality and density in the mid range of a good tube system. yours is not the only speaker like it. so there are many individuals that like ss but prefer tubes and visa versa. i think clearly it is a matter of what you have at home and what interfaces best with it. and to a lesser degree, what is the best you have heard in your system. in this regards you are way more fortunate than most.
best, b |
Hi Rleff. I just don't know. And don't get me wrong, the Pass XA30.5 and Aleph J sounded extremely good with the Merlins, but I still preferred the Atma-sphere and Music Reference amps. It just maybe that I am too much of a tubeaholic to ever really be totally satisified with an SS amp - but I won't stop trying; though I think Nelson Pass is about as good as it gets in SS. My friend loves his Rowland Concentra, maybe I can get him to.... |
Pubul57 would the older jeff roland amps(models 6,8t,9t) be a good match for the Merlins;I have a pair of model 6 monoblocks driving usher rw 723's and its just a great sound;I would think driving Merlins the sound would be even better. |
Paul,
We look forward to your impressions and informed observation as well of the Master BAM & RC :-) |
That BEL amp is one amp I wish I had the chance to have tried, Bobby speaks very highly of the BEL. I too had the Ars Sonum, and it is a wonderful integrated, but ulitmately I prefered the Atma-sphere gear which has bested a lot of other stuff I had tried, but would love to have an SS amp that is a killer with the Merlins and I suspect the BEL would be the one for me to try. It will be interesting to know what you think of the BEL versus the McCormack. |
Linkster,
I agee; I think the Alana is good amp that is markedly improved with the Mk III upgrade. I have not A/B'ed it to the Hovland but plan to. It certainly will not leave my abode for awhile, if ever. |
Farmdoc, I had my Alana updated to Mk III status (from Mk II) by David Gill last month. It's easy when he only lives five miles from my home. At the same time he installed balanced outputs which happen to be the preferred mode of operation for my Einstein LITD power amp. Now there is a real combination that would make your MXe's sing! The Alana is a real giant killer and a bit of an underground product. |
Something else to consider, Pubul; I'm using the ARS Sonum (latest edition) and still am breaking it in.(about 2-300 hrs.) I switched my VSM MXe's over to a ss amp for awhile and was surprised about the soundstage and depth of the music.(Female vocals, light jazz, choral) I was plugged into a McCormack DNA 1 that had the platinum upgrades from Steve McCormack fronted by a Gill Art Audio Alana pre which was also upgraded by David Gill. I am having trouble putting the ARS back in the system to continue the break-in. At my other home, I have a Hovland hp 100 and a BEL 1001 Mk V that I'm going to put into the Merlin system for comparison soon. It is a wonderful synergy for a low powered ss amp and the Hovland and I'm looking forward to the combo voicing the VSM's. I've not heard the Belles, but a modded McCormack with a quality tube pre might be a consideration. |
Well, the check is in the mail. We'll see what the next refinement of the VSM brings to the table. So far, every upgrade Bobby has made to the speaker has made a great speaker just that much better, so I look forward to listening to the MasterBAM and RCs. |
Maybe if the MasterBAM weighed 180lbs:). Now where did I put Bobby's number.... |
Paul,
If you can do the Cat, you know you can do the MBAM{:^)~ |
I was afraid you would say that:) |
Paul,
The $$ invested will be worth it. The Master Bam RC Networks are ass-kickers to be sure. |
well paul, the bel amp is a one of a kind and everyone who has heard it loved it for its uncomplicated and robust nature. not exactly a tube but as close as one could get with the benefits of ss, wider bandwidth, less distortion and more control. i wish is had 2 of them.
about the master upgrades i hear you. at $225 each or $1350 for the 6 caps, they better be something. but in the bam, the entire signal goes them so they do what they are supposed to do. in the case of the rc network, since they are a termination for the amp providing a 10 ohm load at 100 khz, it makes sense to me that the amp being terminated with a better sounding termination sould make the amp sound as good as it can. imho, copper being better sounding than aluminum.
hope you are well.
bobby at merlin
|
I don't think there is anymore production of Richard Brown's amps, which many say is the best SS amp they have heard. It would be nice if such a great design could be continued by another company, but I guess that just isn't going to happen.
I have been giving the Master BAM some thought, but something about paying so much for a capacitor "upgrade" just is a hard nut to crack. Now if I heard the Deulands and were able to compare them and it was a really noticeable improvement, well then, yeah, I'd have to do it. |
The owner of BEL passed last year and nothing has been said about the company still being operational(not starting any rumors).
'57,
Are you going to upgrade to the Master BAM and networks? |
Denvelle, Can you please PM me at sstalwar@yahoo.com. I can mange to come over at your convenience. And thanks a bunch.. |
Pubul
You might try the TAD Hibachi monos. They are small, traditional A/B monoblocks that run cool, look nice, are modestly priced, and sound very very good with Merlins. Not much flash, but - IMHO - a good ss mate for these speakers
Marty |
That is very strong recommendation for the Belles (for use with Merlins at least). I've been looking for an SS amp to have on hand (and for the summer months) when the 16 output tubes of the Atma-sphere and 8 of the Music Reference put out just a bit too much heat:) I tried several of the Pass/First Watt amps, which are wonderful amps, but I just never felt that I could ever "love" them the way I do the tube amps - perhaps it can't happen as I think the Pass SS is about as good as SS gets (I too think the Ayre is up in that category). I will give the Belles some more thought, I know Bobby has recommended it for years. I also suspect the BEL 1001/2002 would have been a good SS choice as well. Thanks for you sharing your experience. |
Pubul57,
The Belles was an old recommendation from Bobby years ago, but I have definitely tried a slew of amps over the years with my various Merlin speakers, even after acquiring the Belles. For me, tubes are a must in the preamp, more so than the amp. I tried the Ayre AX-7, YBA Passion Integre, Accuphase 306, and recently the new Wyred 4 Sound Sti-500 integrated amp (surprisingly I much preferred the W4S integrated to the other more expensive amps). However, none of them locked in on the VSM-MXe's tonal capabilities like my current Bel Canto/Belles setup. I also tried the Cary SLP03 tube preamp, but did not like it with the Merlins. Also had a few BAT-300x-SE amps and was very fond of them, but with the Merlins they seemed to push the mids causing the bass to be slightly subdued - and the BAT does not have a tape loop, which is my preference for setup with the BAM.
When I owned the TSM-M monitors I tried a Rogue all tube setup, and loved the mids but the bass was just too slow for me. The Belles never sounds harsh, has all the power I'll ever need, and has been very reliable (a must since I have my system on most of the evening and use it for general TV viewing in addition to music).
Denvelle |
Denvelle, I've often heard that the Merlins work very well with Belles, did you ever compare them with a tube amp, or did you go straight to Belles when you got the speakers? Just curious, I would like to have an SS amp on hand that we makes magic with Merlins. |
Sstalwar - I don't know of any Merlin dealers in Central Florida. I live in Deltona, which is probably more than a 100 miles from you, near the East Coast, but you're welcome to come over and listen to the VSM-MXe's if you're interested. I drive them with a Belles 150 Reference power amp, Bel Canto SEP2 tubed preamp with an inboard DAC2, and a McCormack UDP-1 CD player. So if you want to hear a fully tubed system, you'll have to bring your own amp :)
Cheers,
Denvelle |
One of the two has more flesh on the bone, I'll let you guess which one. If I had to own one with the Merlins it would be the Ars; obviously the Pass will sound great with wider range of speakers, but as great as it is, it is still not tubes if that is the type of sound you want - I do. |
'57,
How does the Pass compare to the Sonum? |
Arj, that sounds like a wonderful combo. |
