How do you know what your weakest link is?


I'm  contemplating what to upgrade and need some advice on what my weakest link is? I'm considering either upgrading my Clearaudio Concept Wood to a Performance DC Wood/Ovation with a Hana ML or upgrading my Musical Surroundings Nova III to a Modwright 9.0. Is my table the weak link or is my phono? What will my best gain come from and what should I expect that gain to manifest as? 
128x128j-wall
If you think your system consists entirely of these few components, that is your weakest link.
Thanks for your thoughtful contribution to the betterment of hifi and audigon. 
Both matter ( of course ) but when in doubt I always lean towards turntable upgrades ( vs cart or phono ). I know some will disagree but the table sets the fundamental quality level imho...
As to which is weaker in your system I cannot say.
When did you know your gear started to outclass itself? At this point I'm purely judging on cost. Are there any other indicators I should be looking at? 


When you repay truth with snark, why bother? Outta here- permanently.
Post removed 
OP, you’re a bad boy for not sitting still while the dude with the Einstein avatar lured you in for another cut and paste lecture about how "everything matters."

You asked a straightforward and carefully worded question and you deserve a reasonable answer; if there’s more to your question than you realize (happens to me all the time), the civil thing for someone to do is have a conversation with you and try to find out what else is going on. Neither you nor anyone else deserves to be made into punching bag for "truth-bearers." They’re just sophists, anyway; best for them to move their hustle to another thread.
j-wall

There are a few different upgrade paths you could take.
1. Upgrade your table and cartridge as you mention
2. Upgrade your phono preamp
3. Upgrade your cartridge and phono preamp, keeping the same turntable.

Generally I think the analog hierarchy is Tonearm, Cartridge, Phono Preamp, and Turntable.

I would not upgrade the turntable, unless the upgrade includes a better tonearm. I looked at a website and it appears that the turntable upgrade you are considering has the same tonearm as your current turntable.

Based on that, if correct, I would upgrade the cartridge and phono preamp, or upgrade to a turntable with a better tonearm. I am not saying your current tonearm is bad, just saying a better tonearm allows better performance from your cartridge. 

Good luck with your search.

Jim Perry

Your weakest link is the one that does not contribute any more after a major gear change. In simple terms upgrading your tt would bring a quiter ride and more stable sound. Upgrading your cartridge could bring a more refined sound with better info retrieval. Upgrading your phono stage could bring more air, better presentation, more dynamics. You have to balance all the above to see what you are looking for. 
My approach would be to go after the best table i could afford, then arm, then phono stage then cartridge.
All that depending on your lp collection and how far you want to go.

@petg60 thanks for the insight as always. I may have a decent phonostage as I'm guessing and a table/arm upgrade may be in the cards. I refuse to get rid of my Hana ML though as I love this cart. 
The weakest link is the one YOU think is the weakest link.

The Modwright  will give you a tube perspective(flavor) to your LP playback. Try it, you may like it. Many here do. Tube units subjectively sound more organic. You just put up with a little hiss during quiet passages and volume cranked. Units that incorporate FET's are quieter than all tube-Modwright is one of them. Most of the popular units are of this topology.

Once I went tube phono, no going back-unless it were the highest order of SS unit$. Ever notice how super high end SS sounds similar to tube gear?
j-wall,

The first step may be to ensure your existing system is operating at its best. 

How many hours on your cartridge?

Are you certain the stylus tip and all connections (including headshell to cartridge pins) are clean?

Have you verified all elements of your cartridge set up/alignment are correct, including loading?

And lastly, are you aware of sonic degradation over time or are you simply feeling a sonic upgrade is due?

If any or all of this suggests an upgrade is warranted then I would start with the cartridge.  Along with speakers and room set up that is likely to make the greatest difference. 
@tablejockey I had a dealer tell me there isn't going to be a major step forward going from my $1500 Nova III to the Modwright 9.0/x. At double/triple the pricepoint from 9.0/x how can this be? Anyone else please feel free to help educate me. 

I may give the 14 day trial Modwright as I'd like to test the unit, but I'd prefer to avoid half steps and if it takes $4k+ then I'll wait to make the move. And surely the Nova III is a nice unit, but it equals a unit twice a much? I don't buy it!
The Modwright 9.0 is perhaps the best bang for the buck.
Check it out…
For sure, the source is the main link in a system.
I heard a million dollar system trashed by a poor CD player!
Wanted to run out of the room screaming.
You may only be interested in changing the few items you listed but as MC was getting at is that we need to see the whole system to make a recommendation. Back in the day we saw many hi-end turntables paired with 139 dollar loudspeakers. Knowing the whole picture really helps to see what your weak link is and it's often something you were not thinking about. 
@russ69 I should probably set up my virtual system on here. Either way: Focal Sopra 2's, Clearaudio Concept Wood, Hana ML, musical surroundings nova III, linear power supply, Primaluna Dialogue Premium pre with Shunyata  Venom V12, Primaluna Dialogue premium HP power with Shunyata Venom HC power cable , Ps Audio P10 power regenerator with Audioquest Thunder power cable, rocket 88 speaker cables. 


OP the truth is few here had heard most of the components in your system….. so belief systems, personal ownership bias, etc kick in. Maybe some science….

My belief system and hearing some of your gear, in myriad combination with other gear would be to isolate the table, especially IF as you say the ML is sacrosanct.

An honest question, how do you know it ( in isolation as a link ) is as good as you say ? Yes, i own one also…on an ancient but formidable TT and certainly an arm w competent bearings, etc…

Room, tell us more about that ? Leapfrog the random wander upgrade crowd by knowing your RT60….and doing something about the issues.

Hope i have helped, enjoy the music, and the journey…

Even my master sensei himself has… a sensei..

i seek to learn
BTW, sorta  iron chef looking at your pile of ingrediants, should sound pretty darn good…..

@tomic601 very small 9 x 13 x 8 ft room. Two diy acoustic panels made from rockwool and burlap. It sure ain't no Gik, but it seems to help. Isolation is a good call. All components are on a solid steel rack. I guess it couldn't hurt to try some isolation devices under some components. I've considered ordering a set of those asc tube traps as well to see how they do.
had a dealer tell me there isn’t going to be a major step forward going from my $1500 Nova III to the Modwright 9.0/x. At double/triple the pricepoint from 9.0/x how can this be? Anyone else please feel free to help educate me."

The tube phono presentation will offer another perspective and the ears will tell you stay or go.

Maybe a decent "budget" tube stage can show you what the fuss is all about-https://www.analogplanet.com/content/hagerman-audios-tubey-quiet-trumpet-mc-phono-preamplifier


Mikey and others here say it’s good.

"very small 9 x 13 x 8 ft room"

near field should be like being between giant headphones with those Sopras. 
Just something else to try. YMMV
http://www.cardas.com/room_setup_calculators.php

Pulling the speakers out more, and even closer together along with your seat I imagine would less room interaction? 
@tablejockey 
I'm almost sitting on them. 46" from front wall and 25" from side walls. Bass is slightly boomy, but bass traps eventually. 

So cost isn't always a factor, and maybe not within someone's "taste", but at this level it isn't indictive of more resolution, depth or space? I figured the midfi is where everyone is fighting over to gain market share and sonics are held over lifestyle brands. I'm off the mark I take it?
If you can stretch for it, try LS footers for speakers from critical mass systems.  They decouple your speakers from the room in a wonderful way.  In my system they removed all traces of edginess (yes edginess) and boom.  Their CS footers for electronics and TT's are no slouch either.  A single set of these under your TT may give you a relatively cheap upgrade that would obviate the need for a component upgrade.  I say may, because I don't have a TT, so my experience limited to what they did with electronics.  Check reviews. 
You can't tell what is your weakest link just by playing your system as you can't know what component is doing what.
You have to swap out successive components one a a time and observe the changes.  Experience listening to many other systems will also help.

You also need to decide if you want to be a tweaker.  You can add tweaks, again one at a time, retaining your present system and determine if you think any changes they make are positive or not.
@ j-wall 

Think I would focus on the phono stage. not sure what your budget is but would see if you can stretch and pick up a used Chinook. 


@johnss I've considered the Chinook, but I've seen many reports of noise, picking up fm signals and more selling them than keeping them. I'm hoping a Modwright will alleviate all of that and it will be a keeper. We'll see where I go from here I guess 
"I'm almost sitting on them. 46" from front wall and 25" from side walls. Bass is slightly boomy, but bass traps eventually."

Yeah, you have a lot of speaker in that small room. 

"I've considered the Chinook, but I've seen many reports of noise, picking up fm signals and more selling them than keeping them."
The times I demoed one in my system, very quiet.

This looks interesting-
https://www.analogplanet.com/content/hagerman-audios-tubey-quiet-trumpet-mc-phono-preamplifier
@tablejockey I'd be interested in doing a pool for gear. We should get some people together so we can all experiment and try gear. Let's start with the Hagerman. 
"...@russ69 I should probably set up my virtual system on here...."

I thought I looked. Did you post that yesterday? Anyway that was very helpful. I like your system. I don't have much to input other than a cartridge change always brings about a new and different sound. My other thought is I have not heard the PrimaLuna pre-amp but it could be holding you back. You might want to try something else in that position and see. 
@russ69  I actually updated my profile after I thought about it. I'm still thinking the bigge changes will probably come from my table or phono so I'll be starting there before the PL.