Contact Class D Audio. They have a you have nothing to loose trial. Try the matched pair of GAN FET mono blocks? I was in the same boat whereas I needed some amps I could move around with ease. I have a new pair (14 pound ship weight) that arrived on Saturday.
At the 30 hour mark of play they came into their own. Lost brilliance, sound stage became more pronounced, musicality became more natural.
More time is required for a final evaluation but as of right now I think I’ll be happy.
https://classdaudio.com/product-category/gan-monoblock-amps/
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Maybe look at Vinnie Rossi, made in USA see here and here.
Mike
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I wouldnt hesitate to pair them with a 75wpc McIntosh MC275 tube amplifier. Also, you could go with a Clean 200wpc solid state amp. To tell you the truth these are super easy speakers to drive. You will find that the speaker will open up and be way more dynamic if you use a good solid state amp with double the power! You could go with a pair of 400+ watt mono blocks! Dont over think it just listen to at least three different ones.
Matt M
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My GE Triton Reference speakers @ 94db sensitive are powered by a 300wpc McIntosh MC302 power amp. Going from a 100wpc amp to the Mac brought more solid sound, better transients and an overall ease to the music. I would never go back to lower wattage.
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I have found my favorite to date with the Audio Research GS150
such clean all tube power and it drives my Vandersteen 5’s with precision.
Have it paired with Convergent Audio Technolgy SL1 preamp and could not be happier. Highest recommendation I can give
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Nice speakers, I ran Levinson amplification when I had my Jbl’s and it was a great match. Power really opens them up and controls the bass nicely. You have many options and also consider ARC Ref 160’s or for less the Ref 110 is a great buy as well. I used one with NOS Winged C 6550’s and they it was a very musical amplifier with those installed. Good luck and enjoy those JBL’s1
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Take a look at the Coda Continuum No 8. Or No 16 if you can afford it. These amps fly under the radar but are very good. Amperage to drive anything with ease.
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@neonknight
whats the rest of your system look like and what’s your budget?
I love my First Watt Sit-4 with your speakers the Sit-5 would be heaven….
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From ChatGPT
You’ve got an insightful history with amplification and speaker pairing, and it’s clear you’ve put a lot of time into understanding synergy with JBL’s larger-format speakers like the 4367. Since you’re open to tube, solid-state, and Class D, here’s a curated shortlist of top-tier amp candidates across those categories that should be well-matched to the JBL 4367’s 94 dB sensitivity and impedance profile, with your room and listening setup in mind.
🔌
Solid-State Amps (Class A / A/B)
Best for tight bass control and dynamic punch
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Pass Labs XA25 or INT-25
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Pure Class A, incredibly transparent, great harmonic texture
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25W/ch may seem low, but works very well with high-efficiency speakers like the 4367
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Delivers better bass control than expected given the wattage
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First Watt SIT-3 (if you can find one used)
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Single-stage, single-ended transistor design with tube-like harmonic character
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18W/ch — surprisingly capable with JBLs
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You’ve already had good results with the F7, this is a logical upgrade path
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AVM Ovation SA 6.3 or PA 8.3
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Since you liked AVM before, the new Ovation line retains their house sound but with greater refinement
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Burmester influence is present but subtle; hybrid tube/SS variants are now available
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Serviceability is improving in the U.S. under Burmester
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BAT VK-255SE / REX 500
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High current, clean and full-bodied; pairs well with speakers needing drive and control
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If you go BAT, the REX gear is a big step up, especially the hybrid variants
🔋
Class D Amps
Modern modules paired with well-designed front ends can sound extremely natural and dynamic.
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Atma-Sphere Class D Monoblocks
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Ralph Karsten’s latest innovation: GaN FET topology, fully differential, zero feedback
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Tube-like smoothness with Class D efficiency and tight bass
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Excellent match for horns and dynamic drivers
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Orchard Audio Starkrimson Ultra Monoblocks
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GaN FET tech; very fast and resolving without being sterile
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Has impressed even analog/tube-centric listeners
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Modular upgrade paths and reasonably priced
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AGD Productions Tempo or Audion
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Gallium Nitride (GaN) modules encased in tube-like enclosures
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Fast, dynamic, and eerily tube-like in presentation
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Used by many horn and high-efficiency speaker owners
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VTV Amplifier with Purifi 1ET400A & Tube Input Stage
🔥
Tube Amps (Push/Pull)
Warmth, tone, and dynamics—but need the right power and control
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Rogue Audio Stereo 100 / Apollo Dark Monoblocks
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VAC Renaissance 70/70 or Signature 200 iQ
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Refined, dynamic, with the iQ auto-biasing system
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Stunning synergy with high-sensitivity dynamic speakers
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PrimaLuna EVO 400 Power Amp
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KT88/EL34 options, autobias, tube rolling-friendly
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Warm, musical, and surprisingly punchy
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Air Tight ATM-2 or ATM-300R (if sticking with SET)
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For a luxurious, boutique option
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ATM-2 is a push/pull EL34 amp with enough drive and grace
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ATM-300R (300B SET) would be limited but could work in near-field
💡
Power Requirements for Tubes (Push/Pull)
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Minimum: 20–25W/ch for intimate listening or near-field
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Ideal: 40–70W/ch push/pull (EL34, KT88, KT120)
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Overkill: 100W+ (KT150 or high-output mono pairs)
The 4367’s 15” woofer and horn need damping and control, especially at low-to-mid frequencies. A SET amp, unless it’s something like a 211 or high-watt 300B with a powerful output transformer, will struggle. Push/pull KT88-class amps offer a sweet spot in dynamics and control for these JBLs.
🧠 Final Thoughts
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If you want a tube-like tone with modern control, the Atma-Sphere Class D or Orchard Starkrimson are front-runners.
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For best SS drive and tone, Pass XA25, AVM, or BAT are excellent bets.
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If returning to tubes, go push/pull, KT88–KT150, and aim for >40W/ch.
If you’d like, I can build a table comparing sonic character, estimated price range, and match score for each of these amps to help guide your final decision. Would you like that?
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Thanks for sharing the feedback you’ve received—there’s a solid mix of personal experience, enthusiasm, and varying levels of technical insight in the responses. Below is a critique of each post, offering perspective on what is valuable, what may need deeper examination, and how useful the suggestion is for your JBL 4367 application:
1. hbarrel — Class D Audio GAN Monoblocks
Summary: Recommends trying Class D Audio GAN monoblocks with a trial period. Reports initial improvement after 30 hours of play.
Critique:
-
Pros: Suggests a low-risk audition approach and firsthand experience with burn-in characteristics.
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Cons: Class D Audio’s GAN monoblocks are lower-tier compared to brands like Atma-Sphere, Orchard, or AGD. While they may be good value, they’re not boutique or refined in the same way as the amps you’ve historically preferred (Classe, AVM).
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Verdict: Worth testing for curiosity’s sake, but may not match your reference expectations long-term.
2. ditusa — Vinnie Rossi
Summary: Brief mention of Vinnie Rossi as a potential choice.
Critique:
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Pros: Vinnie Rossi’s hybrid designs (especially the L2i Signature integrated or Brama) are exceptional performers—liquid, open, and dynamic with tube input stages and MOSFET outputs.
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Cons: The suggestion is too brief and lacks context (e.g., power output, synergy with JBL, price).
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Verdict: A strong contender worth exploring seriously. Vinnie Rossi hybrid designs could be perfect for the 4367—definitely merits more research.
3. mattmiller — McIntosh MC275 or High-Power Solid State
Summary: Recommends the MC275 tube amp or going big with 400W+ solid-state monoblocks.
Critique:
-
Pros: Acknowledges that the JBL 4367 is easy to drive and emphasizes the dynamic benefits of higher power.
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Cons: The MC275 (75W) is arguably underpowered to fully control the 15” woofer unless you’re listening at moderate levels. The “just get 400W monoblocks” approach lacks nuance—more power isn’t always better, especially with horns.
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Verdict: While the MC275 is classic and well-liked, its synergy depends on your room and preferred SPLs. Solid-state with 200–300W is plenty for 94 dB efficiency; going higher could sacrifice finesse for brute force.
4. stereo5 — McIntosh MC302 with GE Triton Refs
Summary: Shares personal success with a 300W McIntosh amp on 94 dB speakers.
Critique:
-
Pros: Valid anecdote about the sonic benefits of moving from lower to higher wattage.
-
Cons: GE Triton Refs have powered subwoofers and a different tonal profile than JBL 4367s. Not a directly transferable comparison. Also, this user’s tone leans toward absolutism.
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Verdict: Not a direct match in terms of speaker design and synergy, but the benefit of quality high-powered SS amplification is still a valid takeaway.
5. larrybemm — Audio Research GS150 with Vandersteen 5s
Summary: Enthusiastic endorsement of the GS150 driving Vandy 5s, paired with CAT SL1.
Critique:
-
Pros: ARC GS150 is a very refined tube amp with power to handle complex loads. CAT preamp is excellent. Vandersteen 5s are similarly revealing speakers, so this could translate well.
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Cons: Limited detail on the match with JBL specifically.
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Verdict: The GS150 and similar ARC tube designs are worth shortlisting for your application. They offer high current, control, and harmonic richness—ideal for 4367s.
6. cfarrow — ARC Ref 110 or 160, Levinson
Summary: Used Levinson amps with JBLs. Recommends ARC Ref 160 or 110 with Winged C 6550s.
Critique:
-
Pros: Useful pairing insights; mentions tube rolling with the Ref 110 to shape tone. ARC Ref series is known for combining precision and musicality.
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Cons: ARC Ref 110 is an older design; good value used, but might require tube replacement and maintenance.
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Verdict: A knowledgeable post—Ref 160M/S especially should be on your radar. Levinson could be too dry for some, but it offers great control.
7. fthompson251 — Coda No. 8 or 16
Summary: Suggests the Coda No. 8 or 16 as under-the-radar high-quality amps.
Critique:
-
Pros: Excellent suggestion. Coda is known for smooth, Class A sound in early watts with massive current capability. Neutral, clean, dynamic.
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Cons: May lack the tube-like romanticism if that’s part of your tonal preference.
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Verdict: A superb option for your speakers—quiet, effortless, transparent. A No. 8 would be more than sufficient in your room.
8. charles007100 — First Watt SIT-4/SIT-5
Summary: Likes his First Watt SIT-4 with JBLs; recommends SIT-5 if available.
Critique:
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Pros: Direct experience with your speaker model; First Watt synergy is real for horn lovers.
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Cons: The SIT-5 is not widely available yet; SIT amps have low power output and are best for moderate SPL or smaller rooms.
-
Verdict: If you listen at moderate levels, a SIT amp could provide incredible tonal realism and imaging. You already own the F7, so this is a natural extension.
🔍
Overall Takeaways
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Poster
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Strength of Recommendation
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Critique Summary
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hbarrel
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🟠 Moderate
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Good value suggestion, but not in line with your prior reference-level amps
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ditusa
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🟢 Strong
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Underrated hybrid gear (Vinnie Rossi) that suits your goals—research further
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mattmiller
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⚪ Mixed
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Power emphasis valid, but lacks nuance in recommendation
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stereo5
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⚪ Mixed
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Not an ideal comparison speaker-wise, but power observations are reasonable
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larrybemm
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🟢 Strong
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ARC GS150 is a solid tube recommendation, and CAT is world-class
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cfarrow
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🟢 Strong
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Levinson and ARC Ref 110 are proven combos with JBL—good suggestions
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fthompson251
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🟢 Strong
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Coda No. 8/16 offers huge value and performance—shortlist this one
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charles007100
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🟢 Strong (niche)
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If you love the First Watt sound, SIT amps are golden—just know the limits
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Would you like me to synthesize this into a refined shortlist or a side-by-side matrix including your past amps and how these compare in control, warmth, refinement, and synergy with the JBL 4367?
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You might consider a Bryston 3B3 or 4B3. Plenty of clean power, great woofer control, and under 45 lbs. That would be my choice.
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I know this won't sit well on this forum, but it's quite amazing how AI can help us audiophiles. I'm curious to know how accurate it is at synergy.
It would be great is Audiogon had their own AI chatbot with the entire history of these posts to use in its response.
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Usually one of the problems with efficient speakers is the gain in the amps, you have to much gain so the preamp has no room to work with. I had to "build " my own amps since the output from a modern dac or phonostage is very high so I would like to state that you shouldn't blame the amps of being to powerful ( you rarely have to much power) it's how you treat the throttle.
Back on the subject I'm +32 or whatever on the first watt bandwagon 😁
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Vinnie Rossi BRAMA Integrated Amplifier is Voltage gain adjustable!
Mike
Specifications
______________________________________
- AC Mains Input: 100-264Vac (50-60Hz)
- Output Power:
– 200W RMS per channel into 8 ohms
– 400W RMS per channel into 4 ohms
– Unconditional stability into 2 ohms.
- THD+N: Less than 0.1% (20Hz – 20kHz)
- Frequency Response: 5Hz – 100kHz (+/- 0.5dB)
- Signal-to-Noise Ratio: Greater than 100dB
- Input Impedance: 20k ohm
- Gain: Adjustable: 22dB (low) / 28dB (med) / 34dB (high)
- Balanced Line-Output Impedance (XLR): Less than 100 ohms
- Speaker Output Impedance: Less than 0.01 ohms
- Triodes: Western Electric WE300B (matched pair)
- IEC Jack Fuse: 16A 250V (5x20mm), Fast Blow, Ceramic Type
- Power Consumption (Idle): 70W
- Product Weight: 50 lbs. (22.7 kg)
- Product Dimensions (including knobs, jacks, feet): 18.7″ x 16″ x 5.5″ (475mm x 406mm x 140mm)
- Remote Dimensions: 6″ x 2″ x 0.5″ (150mm x 50mm x 12.5mm)
- Shipping Weight: 73 lbs. (33.1 kg)
- Shipping Carton Dimensions: 25″ x 21″ x 11″ (635mm x 533mm x 279mm)
(Vinnie Rossi reserves the right to change product features and/or specifications without notice to improve reliability, function, design, or otherwise)
______________________________________
Travel Case
The Brama Integrated Amplifier ships in an air-tight hard case with custom foam interior, 4-latches, rubberized handle and automatic air-pressure release valve.
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Being the heretic I am....Studio/stage speakers in the heritage, try a stage/studio amp or two....one can get both for what one would pay for one, used ’gently’ (maybe) to toe-dip into serious D-amps.
There are those who accept trade-in’s towards new and you can avoid having a pair of space heaters....unless in need of such later in the year when we stop broiling around here. *L*
MHO overall is it’s expensive to improve on what we subject ourselves to at most any given concert....pick your pref as to what.
(Egg/rock/vegetable shields UP)
I can recommend me ’fav’ for the above, but you’ll have to ask me elsewhere.
Teasing our AG overlords is like being the sub matador...* SAWPK*
Good luck, J
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SAWPK x-lation Suddenly And Without Previous Knowledge.
*not copywrote*
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We can see that Chatbot gets things wrong.
It listed our Class D, which employs a lot of feedback (about 37dB) so is not a 'zero feedback' design.
@neonknight
I run a similar speaker (Classic Audio Loudspeaker T3.3) which also uses 15" woofers, bass reflex with a horn midrange.
I run it with a set of class D monoblocks which I found better suited than the tube amps which were used in the design of the speakers.
With 94 dB in most rooms you'll want at least 60 Watts. So SETs of any kind are not going to work with your speakers (if you want the best results), not just because of the sensitivity but also the impedance.
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+1 on COD; but, their S5.5 model is probably a better match for your JBL speakers.
There are 2 used ones currently listed on USAM, ranging from $4200 - $4,800. There is also one listed at The Music Room for $5,199* (retail is $6400).
*FYI - The Music Room offers a "buy it - try option!"
Best of luck in your search!!
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You might consider an integrated amp from Rogers High Fidelity. I have similar high sensitivity speakers to those w/ big 15” woofers & horn loaded mids & tweeters (Volti Rivals) & his EHF 200 Mark II drives them superbly in a big room.
The amp is hand made w/ point to point wiring w/ high quality parts & sounds excellent w/ lots of power (100 watts/ side in pure class A!). It’s is physically big & heavy & puts out some heat for sure & pricey but comes w/ a full lifetime warranty!!
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I used to to own the 4367. They will play loud no matter what. The sensitivity has little meaning with them. The issue is what is needed to control the woofer, so it is as congruent as it can be with the midrange/tweeter. The woofer is the best part of the speaker, in my opinion. KT88 amps will not work well; I tried. The only amp I found to work was ML 532H. I am sure there are better amps, but ML makes for a good baseline for the 4367s to sound correct. Another 150 watt SS amp I tried was underpowered.
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The woofer is the best part of the speaker, in my opinion.
I agree! The JBL 2216Nd-1 woofer is phenomenal and it won't compress under high level input power (like four hundred watts). Actively bi-amping the JBL 4367 will bring them to another level.
Mike
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Most of the posts on this thread come from those much more experienced than I. However I’ve had a fair amount of exposure to older JBL’s , some small L19, some large, twin 15’s with a horn. Even though they show a reasonable Db output and sometimes state modest wattage, they LIKE POWER, BIG POWER ! I wish you lived close by as I have Rogue M-180’s Dark and a Hera pre. It would be interesting to mate them up. That being said and reading everyone’s opinion, My 2 cents is tubes 150 wpc or more. The Coda first then the Bryston 4cubed. If it was me i’d love to try those Atma-Sphere Class D monos mated to my Rogue Hera pre. In regards to that the Hera has a lot of gain, but it has 5 output settings. I’m running Tektons ( go ahead and shoot me 😆 ) , and they can run low power AND hi. So I’ve run a 50 wpc op amp for giggles and it’s great until it clips at 75-80 db. I have JBL 4312’s and 50 wpc Dynaco MK III’s will drive them to 85 db but the SQ is lacking. The First Watt would probably be nice for low level listening and the Pass would be pretty nice. Ask @hilde45 about his JBL’s he’d be spot on. So in closing maybe a pair of Class D’s and a First Watt or Pass to rotate. I live where it’s 100* today and I’m trying to scratch up $6K to call Ralph. Those Rogue M-180’s draw as much power as my pool and keep my living room warm in the winter. Bill at Rogue Audio paired the ST -100 Dark to the small Megapans , but I’m not sure they are powerful enough, you could call him. Damn I sure can ramble, Cheers , Mike B.
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Just wanted to take a moment and say thanks for all the posts, I have read and thought about every one of them.
Class A is intruiging but I am not wild about the heat generated in the summer. I have a closed off listening room and even with the Classe I get a fair amount of heat build up. I leave my SS gear on 24/7 and that is not a great idea with class A amps.
I do shop the pre owned market quite a bit. I have always wondered about the Rowland Class D amplifiers, but it seems like most of those are earlier generation Ice modules, and I wonder how they compare to the new Purfi or Hypex offerings.
I was reading a technical piece from the designer of the Purifi I believe, and his take on GanFet was quite interesting, in that the devices itself is not a game changer in terms of its relation to other output devices, but rather the circuit architecture matters more. Which leads me back to Purifi or Hypex. What seems to be the main variable is what is used for the input buffer, whether it be tube or certain kinds of high performance op amps. But on the other side of the coin folks seem to say good things about the Orchard Audio amps based on GAN Fet.
One other thought I had is the Odyssey amplifiers. I have heard Klaus pieces at a couple of shows and they always intrigued me. I also remember a few posts of early failures on amps, but that was a number of years back.
What I would like to stay away from is back breaking amps that take a huge amount of real estate in my system. Ideally I would like one I can house in my credenza.
The Classe leave in about 2 weeks. For an interim I can run a First Watt F7 till I find something that catches my eye.
I do appreciate all your thoughts and insights.
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from the designer of the Purifi I believe, and his take on GanFet was quite interesting, in that the devices itself is not a game changer in terms of its relation to other output devices, but rather the circuit architecture matters more.
@neonknight This is correct. But I think you might be missing the implication.
What this basically means is that you can build a lower noise circuit using GaNFETs. This matters because you don't want switching noise messing with digital devices or leaking into your FM tuner. By using GaNFETs we were able to get our class D amps to have a lower radiated noise through the air or on the AC line than most tube amps. We also get a low noise figure from the speaker too; even on horns its hard to know the amps are on (which they can be all day and still be stone cold to the touch) until the music plays.
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OP
I don't have your speakers but I heard JBL a lot. i grew up using them, used as always. and you seem to be searching an amp that will bring the best of this speakers to your Particular liking..
To me, you are on the road of needing to audition more amps to find what you are looking for. with that said, IMHO, i suggest the following..(in any order)
1) AtmasSphere Gan Amps
2) AGD Duets
3) Rogue Dragon.
i heard the last 2 above and i think that AGD are really good. very musical and has great control on the woofers. Tube amps as you have said are too hot for summer. if you want to test the waters of Tubes, I truly believe that 845 SET tubes are the way to go, i have a clone 845 type amp and that runs too hot for summer use.
i believe that what you are liking is more towards a class D as for the reasons of light weight and not too hot to use. thereby the list above
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I really dont think people come to the forums to hear advice from CHAT GTP! Gimmie a break!
Anyone can do that!
People want real life advice from those who know, at least that’s what this site has always been about, I hope this isn’t the start of the end in that regard
Matt M
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Interesting that suggestions range in price from about $2K class D to $48K (Vinnie Rossi). Big gap there.
I haven’t heard current class D; would second the suggestion for Mark Levinson.
Maybe try Pass or Hegel or Musical Fidelity too, especially if you can get a quick audition.
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@mattmiller Wrote:
I really dont think people come to the forums to hear advice from CHAT GTP! Gimmie a break!
Anyone can do that!
I agree!
Mike
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you can try 10 amps and then settle on Musical Fidelity. Or you can try Musical Fidelity first and skip the other 9.
Why the latest generation is so hard to look at though is a mystery to me
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@gruvjet
There is no intelligence in AI, that’s supposed to come from the human performing the query. The output from ChatGPT will vary depending on how you structure your query.
You present the ChatGPT output as if it was an Authoritative answer from a Superior Being. What if we all posted our ChatGPT output? Based on how we ask the question, we’ll all get a different response.
Would you want to have to wade through that?
The OP and everyone else can also query ChatGPT, so what value do you think you are providing?
It’s one thing to treat ChatGPT as a research assistant but to not validate the output is pretty lazy. Fact checking is where the real work begins.
Did you ask for sources? Where did ChatGPT get this data? From professional audio reviewers and trade magazines (ex: TAS or Stereophile)? If you don’t ask for sources you won’t know. I’d rather read the source directly so I can form my own opinion rather than have a Pattern Recognition Tool create an opinion for me.
Finally, AI’s often "hallucinate" or lie. If you point out an error in ChatGPT’s output it will typically respond with something like "You make an excellent point! I’ll incorporate that change in my responses from now on."
AI can be used for a lot of good purposes. I recommend you ask ChatGPT what it’s best use is, based on its strengths. Posting on Audiogon won’t be one of them.
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Thanks for the feedback re: ChatGPT. I'm curious to know how accurate the response is. Rather than thumb your nose at it, offer constructive criticism.
Why not use the Audiogon forum as input to the model and have a chatbot within Audiogon?
Are you all saying you won't use AI for audio gear suggestions?
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I recommend you check out the Lejonklou HiFi solid state amplifiers from Sweden. They have an integrated amp, the Boazu 2, under $5000 and exceptional, yet relatively compact, mono block power amps at $6500 each, the Tundra Mono 3.
Check Part Time Audiophile show reports for RMAF 2016 and 2017. In 2016 Rafe Arnott gave the Lejonklou/Nokturne Audio room Best Sound of Show with the previous Tundra Mono 2.2 driving a pair of JBL 3677 speakers. The following year he said the room was even better (although a subwoofer, also JBL driven by a third Tundra Mono had been added).
I am the North American distributor for Lejonklou HiFi you might expect some bias. But I had never heard the JBLs sound that good with other electronics and they were my personal speakers for a number of years. Now I am running a fully rebuilt pair of Quad ESL speakers with the Tundra Mono 3s and they musically outperform anything I have heard on them. I brought an older stock pair of Quads to Axpona in 2019 with the Lejonklou electronics and John Atkinson said they were one of the highlights of the show. A review from Stereophile on the Boazu 2, along with our streamer, the Källa, and our MC phono stage, the Entity 1.2, should be out within a few months from Alex Halberstadt. I don’t know what speakers he will use but he owns Altec A7s and is a fan of horn loudspeakers. I believe he reviewed one of the newer JBL monitor speakers a while back and quite liked them, although I don’t remember if they were 4367s.
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hi
great choice in the 4367.
i have used my 4367 speakers with Gryphon Diablo and then my Audio Note SET amp (211). the only reason i bought the 2nd hand diablo was because i had always wanted to own one and i wanted to know if my preferred amp (SET) was driving them well enough. i figured if not i might bi-amp.
a few points
#1 - imo solid state thru the jbl 4367 isn't default pleasant, even something with a reputation for some sweetness like the diablo. they are a neutral speaker and they don't lie or roll off much. they can sound hard. you can be listening, thinking "wow" but then 2 hours in you realise your ears hurt.
#2- tonally the SET is wonderful. never anything hard or shrill etc. just extremely nice by default imo. i have around same size room as you 13 foot by 16 foot with 16 feet ceilings.
#3 - in a comparison with diablo for music, i couldn't see that the 211 failed with bass woofer control. not at all. i didn't even bother bi-amping. the SET sound was brilliant and i was happy with it in comparison to diablo. for movie watching, i did however find the diablo sounded "better". i think this is because there is so much "atmospheric bass" in movies. so not an issue with 2 channel music in comparison but for movies etc it was discernible. but again the hardness would come in. so it was thrilling watching "the fly" for example with diablo and 4367, but also hurt ears slightly. this is thru a tubed abbas dac.
#4 - the 211 amp i have has huge transformers and i think this helps the 20W of SET power get the job done with these 94 dB efficient speakers.
#5 - i found good footers helped the 4367 be a gentle giant. i put CMS LS2.25 footers on it and this helped the whole thing. the speakers have disappeared now and i get a wide and deep presentation with great dynamics, resolution and tone. it's thrilling. having the speaker elevated is also critical. they were voiced up on cinder blocks as i recall.
#6 - i do find i need to be at around 12 pm on the dial for them to be their absolute best and "come to life". having said that, maybe that's the room. 12 pm is not crazy loud at all (like 80 db kind of thing at listening). so it isn't a problem for me and i don't find that situation to be much different to any other speaker i've heard.
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I can highly recommend the Laiv Harmony GaNM monoblock class D amps to you. I’ve been extremely happy with mine thus far. I am sure they would sound wonderful with your speakers.
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@neonknight wrote:
Out of curiosity: why did you get rid of the JBL 4365’s - i.e.: what did the 4367’s to your ears bring to the table by comparison?
The amplifiers I have been using are a pair of Classe Omega monoblocks. But the reality is they are massive, are way too much power for a pair of 94 db efficient speakers [...]
The first question that pops into my head here, looking past your rationale to let them loose, is how the Classé amps actually mated with the JBL’s from a sound perspective? With regard to power and its speculated excess, practically speaking I don’t believe you can have too much power with more modern JBL’s with larger voice coil woofers - despite their moderately high efficiency; on the contrary more power to such woofers can turn out to be a benefit. Indeed, it’s about how those JBL’s react to more powerful amps/PSU’s, even at lower volumes.
In the past JBL was known to mate well with tube amplification. But I imagine this is going to have to be push/pull.
I believe Greg Timbers had a notable fondness for Quicksilver amps over the horn-loaded mids/high compression drivers of his JBL designs and pairing them with solid state amps for the woofer section, albeit he seemed to find running them actively, initially with analogue, electronic crossovers was the preferred scenario, and so naturally gain matching between the driver sections had to take place anyway. This can be more tricky with passive bi-amping using different amps with different gain horizontally, a configuration that may otherwise have been a shoe-in in your case and trying to take advantage of different virtues of different amps topologies, while largely avoiding their weaknesses selectively.
From my chair though using different amp topologies when bi-, tri- or quad-amping (or more), while tempting at first with the incentive behind it, invites potential new issues that can impact overall coherency, and so my choice would be to look for a same amp solution covering the entire frequency spectrum of the JBL’s. Leading me to this paragraph of yours:
Finally in terms of solid state, the choices are huge. I know McIntosh was often a favored pairing, but I have never been a fan of the brand.
A friend of mine who’s a pro audio dealer while being a true nerd (and gear collector) of an audiophile incorporating pro segment speakers and amps into his private, home audio setups with high-end analogue and digital sources, initially used McIntosh MC2300 amps in numbers over his then large and actively configured JBL 5670-series cinema speakers among others, in addition to Crown Studio Reference I amps later on. Eventually though these all had to go (finding buyers wasn’t a problem, and they willingly paid large sums for these older amps), and instead he set his sights on the british MC² Audio amps from the individuals behind Klark Teknik and Turbosound to take over, and which they have done since.
As it so happens, with his influence I’ve been using MC² Audio in own setup for a few years now, and they are downright excellent amps - both professionally, I’m told, and in a home stereo environment, functionally as well and not least sonically. The catch to audiophiles? Mainly non-fancy pro looks and their built-in fans, which can be replaced with quiet versions. Another catch: low price (we should know what that’s about) and going below radar to most, coming from the pro audio segment not least.
Summing up: using MC² Audio amp myself I have solid experience with them, less so with the JBL 4367 speakers (haven’t owned the 4367’s, although I’ve heard them several times), and not with the combo of those. Still, the MC² Audio T and S-series amps I've heard are smooth, highly resolved and honest sounding with an abundance of power at their disposal, so I can easily imagine them being a very good match with the 4367’s, also from what I know of the characteristics of the latter that I wouldn’t pair with dry sounding amps.
Specifically I’d recommend the T1000 model as an outset, but the more expensive S800 and S1400 are excellent as well though sounding virtually similar to the T1000. The T1000 (depending on the measurement technique) is a 450W/8 ohm amp, class A/B topology, and I use two of them in my own setup actively for my main speakers + the larger T3500 sibling for the subs. The T1000 retails for about €1,700, but please: don’t let the low price scare you off.
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I use a set of JBL 4435s with my Luxman 35mk3 tube preamp with a First watt J2 amp.
I can hit 120db easy but I stay below 80db. This class A amp really does not get really hot like my Threshold 400 a did. If I replaced my amp I would buy a Pass labs xa=25.
Murph
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We have used the Hypex Nilai 500 Monoblocks extensively the JBL 4349s and JBL L65s
We have compared them with: Hegel, Mark Levonson, and Classe, all in this world class category.
We never get bored with or irritated with the Nilai 500s, smooth and Incredibly accurate. Amazing control due to the super high damping factor
Please note, Deer Creek Audio is an authorized Hypex dealer.
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This really has been a fascinating thread - besides knowledge gained from the OP's original question on speaker matching I was exposed a bit more to what AI possibly can/or shouldn't do and how we as purchasers should always to consider the sources and do our own fact checking. All the feedback and comments were civil and never contentious. My thanks go out to @rhg3 for his thoughtful comments. Cant wait to hear what amplifier the OP chooses!
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@atmasphere
So I ordered a set of amplifiers today. Decided to give a pair of the Atmasphere Class D amplifiers a go. I heard them a year or two ago at the Pacific Audiofest. Granted it was under show conditions and with unfamiliar gear. But the potential was there. I then have followed owners experiences over time and it kept my curiosity alive. Finally I had a phone conversation with Ralph at Atmasphere and my impression is that he is a straight shooter, polite, and patient person. Not a bunch of bullshit, just no nonsense engineering based answers. So I am going to give it a go.
i have read all the posts here and many are intriguing. The MC2 amps piqued my interest. JBL has often been paired with commercial/professional amplifiers and it is probably an option worth exploring. I just don’t know if these amps can be found in the US market.
Finally I have a First Watt F7 in my garage. In many ways it has similar voicing to the Classe. It’s a great safety net for me while I explore a few different avenues.
It has been awhile since I listened to Class D amplifiers. In the past I found them too smooth and lacking in harmonic texture and expression. I am hoping Ralph’s design has overcome those limitation!
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With your JBLs, I would highly recommend a good McIntosh tube amp. They
will complement each other like caviar goes with champagne, you will not be disappointed by the excellent sound quality you will get out of both.
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I have written a thread about my experience with the JBL 4367 and various amplifiers. It is titled:
"How can I establish a reference level?"
It is here on Agon in the Tech Forum.
They are amazing speakers!!! I am still in awe when I listen to them.
Slack-jawed awe.
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Atmasphere Class D amplifiers - great choice!
Please let us know what you think of your new combo.
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