McIntosh to Luxman?

Hey, I own the last new 507ux in the US, very happy with it.

The general characteristics are it feels very extended, and makes other amps seem like they don’t have enough bandwidth. It has a very sweet tube-like midrange to treble presentation. While it sounds like the top end goes over forever it’s also super smooth and not harsh.

@erik_squires Thanks for the input! I saw your posts from a few years ago about your Luxman.  I was hoping you'd chime in. 😀

My only concern is that I've regretted selling equipment in the past. If the Luxman is the one, then the McIntosh has to go.  That's the rub. 

Yeah, the 509 would be sweet....but it's at a price-point that's higher than I'm willing to go.   ~ Jerry

Luxman and MacIntosh could not be much more different. Luxman is rather evenly tonally balanced but with forward treble and lean midrange and bass and big on buttons and dials. MacIntosh is very heavy midrange and bass. Mac… the “muscle car”… Luxman the Toyota Avalon.

You definitely need to let your ears draw you to your choice.

My experience with Mac is that it’s very tonally rich but is rolled off in the upper treble range that veils upper-octave detail and the openness of the overall soundstage.  My experience comes from working for Magnolia at Best Buy and hearing the KEF Blades driven by Mac gear and it sounded like a blanket was thrown over the KEFs relative to how I’ve heard them sound at audio shows.  It was a disgrace and total sonic mismatch IMHO.  My guess is Luxman will do a better job in this area without ever sounding etched or hyper detailed.  Given what you’re looking for I think Luxman could be a considerable upgrade.  Just my $0.02 FWIW. 

@soix 

+1

My C2700/MC611 system is excellent. Mid-bass/bass to die for. I do agree about the highs. I fixed this issue by pairing  Nordost Valhalla 2 XLRs between my DAC and the C2700; boy, what a difference! It has transformed the MAC system from top to bottom. 

@jrod68 

I went from a Luxman 590 AXII to my current McIntosh system. The Luxman did not have enough power to drive my speakers. I did compare the McIntosh to the Luxman M10x and accompanying preamp. The Luxman is fabulous and more detailed than the MAC. However, the MAC is warmer and far more powerful with thunderous bass. My preference is for warmth and bass as exemplified by the direction I headed. It's all up to what your ears tell you!

Thanks guys. I really appreciate your input. I like the comparison of McIntosh to a muscle car. Very appropriate! I do appreciate the “tonally rich” sound of my MA252. It sounds like the Lux is a totally different animal altogether. The Mc has qualities that I like, so maybe I’m better off keeping it. I’ll have to check on the TMR return policy. ~ Jerry

TMR has a 14 day return policy. I assume I’m on the hook for return shipping, should I decided against the Luxman.  Shipping is not cheap, but hey, getting a really cool piece of equipment to try out sounds like fun!  Thanks again guys. 
~ Jerry 

If the Luxman revitalizes your system, I’d think the cost of return shipping is a relatively small price to pay, especially at this level.  I say go for it!  Otherwise u may never know, which as a fellow Audiophile I know will gnaw at u like a mole.  Some things are just worth paying for, and an in-home audition is one of them.  Just do it!!!

Go with Mcintosh - the 1.25s

@jrod68 

You will need to upgrade your source component (your Bluesound streamer) to something better. Your Bluesound streamer is the bottleneck and is holding up your entire system setup IMO. 

As for Luxman vs Mac I would say it’s a matter of preference. both are great but I found in general the Luxman sounded more tubey with lush sweet highs and midrange and holographic imaging and soundstage, and while the highs are extended but it’s very smooth with perfect amount of details and resolution. The Luxman IMO has better dimensionality, textures and image specificity compared to comparably priced Mac. The music would sound more dimensional with better instrumental/voice textures and imaging with the Luxman. I felt the Mac slightly lacks the last bits of details, resolution, texture and dimensionality in comparison to Luxman. But again it also depends on what type of speakers you are driving. I’m not sure about your Maggie’s or any Maggie’s speakers in general as I don’t have much experience with Maggie’s at all.
 

My preference would be for Luxman but again it also depends on the synergy between your speakers and amp and other upstream electronics and cables. It’s all about system synergy. There’s no absolute answer in this hobby. Mac gears will pair better with certain speakers while the Luxman will probably pair better with other sets of speakers. 

As a current owner of McIntosh MX160 and MC8207 and former owner of a pair MC1.25kw mono blocks the answer for me is go with the Luxman.  Two years ago I decided to "see what else was out there" and demoed several amps from various manufacturer's.  I demoed Luxman, Audio Research,  Boulder and a few others.  Without a doubt the Luxman was significantly more musical and provided much more depth and detail than the McIntosh. You could hear music on the Luxman, in terms of detail, that you do not hear with the McIntosh. Research Ohms law and it will help provide more guidance about how the Luxman operates versus the McIntosh.  Because the Luxman goes lower in Ohms, especially with electrostats, you will be amazed at your improved soundstage and overall tonality.  Another thing because of how the Luxman is built you don't need as much watts per channel to drive the speakers.  At the time I had Martin Logan ESL15 electrostats and the Luxman combo "blew away" my Mac/Martin Logan combo in every way.  So, my vote is for the Luxman and don't look back.

Let us know what you decide to do.

This is their latest and best the 507Z  my friend bought  one and got a very fair deal 

from Perrotta Consultants  ,these new models have a better layout and sound even better weighs around56 pounds ,very well done ,retail $9500 but he got a nice deal.

I think he got the very good AQ Thunder power cord with it which retail  is over $1k together for under the retail price, if you needed a new top power cord.

https://www.theabsolutesound.com/articles/49344/

I would try the Luxman, I bet you will keep it.

Return shipping Cost: it’s no loss, if you keep it, you have to send them the McIntosh. Keep the McIntosh, return the Luxman, Soooo it isn’t any more cost to try it.

I’ve got a Luxman, 10 wpc tube amp in my Office System. My 1st and only Luxman. Except for price, I wholeheartedly recommend it, and, over time, you forget the price. You are simply not aware of it, just the wonderful involving music.

It has built in MM/MC Phono, I’m using it’s MM with my AT440ml MM cartridge, also quite happy with that part of it. Just to say, I’m happy with all aspects of my Luxman.

https://www.luxman.com/product/detail.php?id=33

https://www.stereophile.com/content/luxman-sq-n150-integrated-amplifier

Now playing my restored AR-2ax, sensitivity 91.5.

https://stereonomono.blogspot.com/2014/05/acoustic-research-ar-2ax.html

Previously played the least efficient 87db speakers I own, Wharfedale Diamond 225.

https://www.wharfedale.co.uk/diamond-225/

As reviewers say, it seems to have plenty of reserve power, yes it does, it drove the inefficient Wharfedale’s with more volume than I want/need. Perhaps ’extra power’ is true of the Luxman you are considering, I suspect so.

.............................................

I had McIntosh Mc2250 SS 250 wpc in main system when I was using my JSE Infinite Slope Model II’s, 4 way sensitivity 90db. I played with more volume in that larger space, and my current at the time 30 wpc tube amps seemed underpowered. I have to agree, it was more like a muscle car, impressive, yet not as invisibly involving.

I went back to highly efficient horns/15" woofer and switched back to tubes, sold the MC2250, don’t miss it one bit.

IF the Luxman had 16 ohm taps, like my Cayin A88T does (22 or 45 wpc) I am sure the Luxman could drive my main system wonderfully. Cayin is also invisibly involving, which is simply magic when that quality exists.

Again, everyone, thanks for your feedback.  It's much appreciated.   

@caphill ...yeah, a new streamer would be next on my list. I guess at the moment,  I'm smitten with the Luxman amp. 

@woots ...thanks for the recommendation 

@audioman58...super cool integrated, and if I had an extra $6k laying around, I'd probably go that route.  I forgot to mention in my post, I want to stay in the $2k-$3k range, out-of-pocket.  Trading in my hybrid McIntosh gets me there. 

@soix...I like your attitude.  Just go for it!   

I'll keep you all updated.  Have a great day!  ~ Jerry 

I did the switch and even a side-by-side comparaison and Luxman was my favorite no questions asked

The Mac: C712 + MC7100

The Luxman: L-509X

The Mac was from the 90's so not a fair comparaison, but there were separate.

The Lux is much more detailled with a wide soudnstage. The voices were crisp and so clear, you can almost smell the breath of the signer!

The Mac has slighly more bass, but not as clean as the Lux. Th overall sound was warmer.

In the end, it is very different sound and it's a matter of personal preferences. And not all Max/Lux sound the same.

@caphill whats a good replacement for Bluesound?  

a few comments to add to this conversation

1. i concur 100% with @ghdprentice on mac vs luxman solid state -- luxman will be leaner cleaner sounding, more linear top to bottom, whereas mac is voiced to me warmer fuller in mids and midbass with notable obscuring of treble detail and air in comparison

2. mac makes ss amps models with and without autoformers, they sound different, autoformers at the output stage gives further warmth, while mac models without will sound more ’typically’ solid state, with better transient response but a leaner presentation - still even non autoformer ss mac amps will be voiced richer warmer than commensurate luxman model

3. the comparison is further complicated by the fact that the op has the mac252 which is a non autoformer HYBRID integrated amp model, with 12au7/at7 tube pre section... thus even more notable tubey presentation, very much apples to oranges vs luxman 507 straight ss class ab

4. as for the bluesound node, if the op has the n130 (latest model, much improved over the older 2 and 2i sonically) the dac analog output will be pretty good, but can be improved with a power supply upgrade (there are several vendors)... i bought one for fun with the pd creative lps mod and using a proper lps the sound is definitely improved (cleaner transients, improved tonality and timbre), the internal smps definitely holds the unit back, slurs the sound and diminishes soundstage

5. even though the bs node with power supply upgrade is very good sounding at under $1000 (with mods and lps) there are many other as good or slightly better sounding dac/streamers on the market in the $1000-1500 price range - which would allow the op to enjoy the purer sound of the luxman more effortlessly

Not sure how helpful this will be. However, FWIW, several years ago, I spent a couple hours critically listening to a MAC MA5200 and the Luxman in a head-to-head demo, using a Rega P3 equipped with an Ortofon Blue, Focal Aria 936 and a Rega Apollo CD player with well-engineered CD recordings and very good, very clean vinyl pressings. The CDs were my own; so, music I was very familiar with. Of course, this was a SS-to-SS shoot-out. What you have in mind is hybrid to SS, a different ballgame. My ears thought the MA5200 and the Luxman sounded virtually identical.

I've never spent any time with an MA252 and haven't spent much time with those Maggies. So, can't say what the A/B matchup you have in mind would be like. Going on specs, alone, I would say your ears will likely prefer the amp with the most robust power supply for those Maggies (i.e.  not WATTS; power supply). Regardless, as with all things audiophile, let your ears be the judge.

BTW: Having critically listened to many MAC amps, over the years (more than Luxies); my ears would most definitely not agree that MAC's general sound signature is "very heavy (on) midrange and bass"; "rolled off in the upper treble range (veiling) upper-octave detail and the openness of the overall soundstage", that "Luxman ... has better dimensionality, textures and image specificity compared to comparably priced Mac(s)", that the "music would sound more dimensional with better instrumental/voice textures and imaging with the Luxman", that "Mac slightly lacks the last bits of details, resolution, texture and dimensionality in comparison to Luxman", that Luxman is "more musical and provided much more depth and detail than the McIntosh", etc.

I would agree, however, that this definitely depends upon the speakers used and likely would be a matter of preference, given equitably matched amps in a head-to-head shoot-out. Speakers are always the business end of any sound system.

I recently traded my Mac MA5300 for a Luxman L-550AX ll. New, out of the box, the Luxman was a great disappointment. After two days, I put it back in the box. Two days later, I tried it again. It started to morph into a revealing, open soundstage approaching holography. It's the most expensive integrated I've ever bought. I do not regret the purchase, and I'm digging it. As previously posted, the Bluesound Node, IMO is your gate.

I owed Mcintosh separates for a long time, once I could afford them. I agree with most of the posts here, it's a bit light at the top end, and to me a bit dark, now that I own the Luxman 590AXII, the Luxman sound could not be more different, and to me much better. I would not go back to Mcintosh, old or new. By the way, I have received a lot of nasty responses any time that I talked down about Mcintosh, but I am  simply telling my experience, the Luxman sounds better to me then the Mcintosh I owned. I would suggest to try it out, with a return policy as it will sound much different then the Mcintosh, and yes, give it a little time it to open up and for you to get use to it.

I also owned the Bluesound (I have since upgraded to Aurender) and would agree with the others that it's a great little streamer, but you could easily do much better. 

I’d put the new Innuos Pulse Mini on your radar for a streamer, and as @jjss49 recommended above an upgraded linear power supply (not necessarily Innuos’ own LPS) should be included in your budget to get the best performance out of it.  Best of luck with all this, and please do share your impressions if you could.  Curious minds wanna know.  BTW, I’ve got 100 bucks the OP chooses the Luxman if anyone wants to take the other side.  Heh heh. 

@paul8088 

As for upgrade streamers/DAC from the Bluesound there are many countless options out there : Aurender, Lumin, Linn, Naim, Chord, Simaudio, PS Audio DS DAC with networked bridge ii, Cary Audio, Teac, Esoteric, DCS, and many others depending on your budget. 

Lots of 100 Volt Luxmans out there...new and used...Be Careful. They're made for the Japanese market and they will sell it to Americans.

It would be good if you could listen the the Luxman in your system before you decide. I own the Ma 352 which is the bigger brother to your amp. I can tell you there are attributes to my mac that I just like. I also have a Pass 250, Accuphase 380, Hegal 390. Yet I still enjoy my mac, and I miss no detail at all. In some cased I hear more detail then my Pass. 

Update…Luxman ordered.  😁 I’ll check back in a week or so. Thanks to everyone. 

~ Jerry

I've had Mcintosh separates (MC452/C2600) for few years and agree with everyone above. MAC is darker sounding with rolled off highs. It does have an amazing midrange and bass. I'm a classical guy and it wasn't enough detail in piano, totally rolled off, and other solo instruments sounded veiled. 

If you're going for Luxman, go for their Class A amps and nothing less. If you get anything less you may regret it and will be tempted to upgrade later. The 590 and 595 in particular were my favorite. These come as close to tube sound as possible without having tubes. Ultimately, I ended up with a powerful SET to drive my speakers. SET is the end game in hi end music. Period. 

Both Mac and Luxman are good gear.  I doubt you're going to hear significant differences.  Certainly not worth what it will cost you for the Luxman, plus the pain of selling off the Mac.  

Do you enjoy what you have now?  If so, be happy with it.

Me?  I wouldn't buy contemporary Mac gear as I don't think it's a good value.  Same with the current line of Luxman either.  

@russbutton There actually is a significant audible difference between McIntosh and Luxman.  The detail and soundstage of Luxman is superior to McIntosh.  Having owned McIntosh 1.25KW mono amps and demoed Luxman products you would be surprised at the differences.  Also, based on @jrod68 speakers he would notice an even bigger difference.  Check out Ohm's law and you will see that the Luxman goes much lower than the McIntosh. Hope this helps provide some color around the two products.

jrod68

congrats, I bet you will love it.

I just glanced thru the manual, love it's optional features

https://luxmanamerica.com/wp-content/uploads/2019/06/L-507uX-English-Manual-print1127.pdf

I'd be careful about letting go of a nice Mac that you like... 

I've owned Mac gear and really enjoyed it.  Then I auditioned it with some Moon gear and I then identified a 'veil' lifted - more dynamics and clarity.  

I switched and have enjoyed it.  And really appreciated my time with McIntosh and encourage you to audition if you can and trust your ears.

I've heard some Luxman gear casually - they make quality gear and I think you are in a win-win situation 

I would like to correct something. I have a Mac 352 Hybrid and it is NOT rolled off at all. In fact I had to change the preamp tubes to warm it up a bit. Treble detail was very good, used on my Goldenear BRX

Luxman class a may be easier jump ...550ax2 or 590ax2 class a for first 20/30w then goes ab .... Bass control good but warm midrange reminiscent of valves ... Think the 505 has the control but not the same musicality if that makes sense 

I'm probably a little late with this, but I was going to suggest doing some tube rolling in the MA252 and see if that helps give you more of what you feel is currently lacking.  I haven't yet done it myself in my Mac tube preamp, but have read many comments about it.  Seems many folks feel the stock JJ tubes are not the best to bring out the full potential of the Mac tube gear.  Improvements in soundstage, bass and "top-end sparkle" are often mentioned.

Good evening. The Luxman arrived today. Got my streamer hooked up and listened for a few minutes. Then my lady says “hey, can you pick up some food?” Off to get Chinese. 😁
 

First impression…holy s***. So the Maggie’s CAN make some serious bass. This thing seems to have unlimited headroom. Wow. More to follow. 
 

~ Jerry 

Good to know the Luxman L-507uX is sounding great. I have the L-590AXII and have owned many integrateds and pre-powers, some costlier than the Luxman. As mentioned by others here, I share the same impressions about the Luxman. Without going into detail, I’ll just say it just sounds right and brings joy to the listening experience.

I’ve briefly tried the McIntosh MC275mkIV years ago and I’m not sure if it’s the typical McIntosh house sound. It’s warm with a full fat bass and lacks air, definition and detail. The overall clarity of the amp is not very good to me.

I cannot comment about the specific model you've mentioned, as I've never owned it.  Below are comment's on what I've owned and hopefully they may be of some help to you:

My first step from a common receiver to separates was first a used McIntosh, than a brand new unit. I do not remember the model numbers of the amp and preamp. At that time, for speakers I've owned B&W 802 series 3. After few months I've stepped up to CJ Premiere, because of sonic preference. After couple of years to Thor Audio. Regretfully, having issues with tubes made me sell them and return to solid state.

Luxman 600 series amp and preamp were my first Luxman components. I liked them so much, I've stepped up to their 900 series after about a year. I've added more Luxman. products later. I have not found the sound lean as one of the entries noted. It is all about the system as a whole. SYNERGY is key. In my case, Luxman electronics, Focal Sopra Speakers, Shunyata Sigma 2 cables are a good match. 

Be well,

vic

Soix

“My experience with Mac is that it’s very tonally rich but is rolled off in the upper treble range that veils upper-octave detail and the openness of the overall soundstage.  My experience comes from working for Magnolia at Best Buy and hearing the KEF Blades driven by Mac gear and it sounded like a blanket was thrown over the KEFs relative to how I’ve heard them sound at audio shows.  It was a disgrace and total sonic mismatch IMHO.  My guess is Luxman will do a better job in this area without ever sounding etched or hyper detailed.  Given what you’re looking for I think Luxman could be a considerable upgrade.  Just my $0.02 FWIW”.

It’s because the Magnolia at Best Buy has to follow the ridiculous floor plan which the setup is a disaster for sound quality.  If you have ever been to a place or speak with the KEF Group, you would understand that the KEF Blades. Reds a lot of room.  You don’t put that kind of speaker next to a wall.  It even sounded horrible with the Mark Levinson Gear.   Not a place to go and listen to a system that’s it setup properly. The amplifier and speakers are not the problem. The room and the setup is along with the folks trying to sell you the gear. 

Reds***Needs 

CORRECTION!!!

It’s because the Magnolia at Best Buy has to follow the ridiculous floor plan which the setup is a disaster for sound quality.  If you have ever been to a place or speak with the KEF Group, you would understand that the KEF Blades need a lot of room.  You don’t put that kind of speaker next to a wall.  It even sounded horrible with the Mark Levinson Gear.   Not a place to go and listen to a system that’s isn’t setup properly. The amplifier and speakers are not the problem. The room and the setup is along with the folks trying to sell you the gear. 

@decathlon1991 At my Magnolia the Blades were set up in their own room and 5 feet away from the back wall so setup wasn’t an issue and they still sounded like crap with the Mac gear.  But I agree in the main listening room the speaker setup is a total joke.  In fact, whenever I did an audition for someone I always pulled the speakers out and set them up so the customer could get a real idea of what they could do.  I will say though that their home install service is exceptional and would recommend it highly even if you don’t buy your equipment there.  They are very professional and experienced, and the price you’re quoted is the price you pay regardless if they run into unseen issues and need to eat the added cost of equipment and labor.  They just do it right, which isn’t always the case with independent installers. 

I have friends who manage what use to be Magnolia and sorry, I wouldn’t let them set up my system. When it comes to Plano design with Best Buy, at every store, the setup is the same.  They don’t deviate from one store to another. In the room where they set it up with the McIntosh MC1.25 Monoblock amplifiers, the room isn’t established properly.  Making a room look decent isn’t the same as setting it up properly to get it to sound good.  The sound bounces around all over the place and it seems hollow.  For that room size, the blade 2’s would be better for that size room but still would need to be dialed in.  Also, one Mcintosh amplifier doesn’t have the same signature sound as another model.  Each model has a different signature sound. I have friends and family members that own a McIntosh/ KEF Blade 1 & 2 combination and their setup sounds amazing.  It takes a while to truly dial in the Blades. I have McIntosh as a theater setup but my listing room is Boulder.  Just my 2 cents worth due to all of the gear I’ve owned in the past 40 years.😀

When it comes to Plano design with Best Buy, at every store, the setup is the same. They don’t deviate from one store to another.

@decathlon1991 While that may be true with your basic Best Buy that’s just simply not true when it comes to Magnolia. In NJ I have four Magnolia stores within a half hour from me, and none of them are set up identically and differ in their number and setup of individual listening rooms. In point of fact, my Magnolia had one separate room set up for only the Blades driven by very high-end Mac electronics including massive monoblock amps, and the other Magnolias did not have this. So that’s that.  Also, I wrote professional reviews of high-end audio equipment for 17 years and have heard Blades in several different systems and all sounded markedly better than the setup at my Magnolia — not even close.  So yeah, I kinda know what I’m talking about here. 

A few years ago when I was shopping for an integrated I narrowed my choices down to a Mac MA2275 and one of the Luxman SS.  After reading a number of posts comparing McIntosh and Luxman, I went for the 507ux.  I am very happy with mine.  The phono section is really good.  I think I would have to pay over $2000 to significantly better it.

That being said, McIntosh generally hold their value much better than Luxman but since you are buying used, that shouldn't be an issue.

The one thing that bothered me about my unit is that it developed a slight buzz after I had it for about 6 months.  The sound comes from the unit itself-it is nothing you hear through the speakers during playback.  It is not very audible but it did bother me.  It seems to be a fairly common issue-something to do with the way the transformers are mounted is what I have read.  Luxman has no interest in addressing it so far as I know.

If you have read my post,  I was only speaking about the Magnolia Best Buy stores only. I’m in Southern California and trust me, growing up on the east coast, sSouthern California have some of the best stores. Most Magnolia doesn’t get the McIntosh MC2KW or McIntosh 1.2KW & 1.25KW.  I’ve traveled all of the world and been to some of the incredible stores during my venture.  As far as you writing for 17 years for a audio magazine, wouldn’t be my decision making on how a system sounds.  As you claim, being a writer and testing systems, you should know systems are room dependent and system synergy.  You may not like the brand or the sound but to say it sounds like crap for an hour or 2 of listening is pretty funny. What you like as appose to what someone else like is called a choice so your point of view wouldn’t matter to them especially if you haven’t heard their system in their environment.  This is why the Audiophile magazines are going to be extinct.  Folks are wising up and thinking for themselves.  Buy with your ears and eyes, not with what someone is telling you to purchase with an article.

You may not like the brand or the sound but to say it sounds like crap for an hour or 2 of listening is pretty funny.

@decathlon1991 I care not where you’re from or where you are now. Your statement that Magnolia stores are all identical is patently false. What’s also false is your assumption that I only listened to the Blades with Mac gear for only two hours. The fact is I got to listen to that system for many months with my own reference recordings I’ve heard on many systems — several of them costing significantly over a million dollars — so I kinda know what they’re supposed to sound like, and the Blades in this dedicated room with top Mac gear sounded like crap. Soundstage was truncated and upper octave details were significantly rolled off, which is absolutely NOT a characteristic of the otherwise excellent Blade speakers. It was a total mismatch. You may like the Mac house sound or you may not, but in my experience hearing several of their models on many different speakers is that they skew toward the warm — and I’d say bloated — side and are significantly rolled off in the upper treble. A lot of people like that “sound” or the attractive blue meters, but it ain’t neutral in the least, which is likely why no reviewers — not one — use them as reference components in their systems. That’s because they only portray their interpretation of the recording and not what’s actually on it, and I think you’ll find the majority of people here would mimic my impressions. But, u do u.

This is why the Audiophile magazines are going to be extinct.

Uh, Rrrriiiiiight. This is your ignorant and warped view of the world. Nuff said.

Nor do I where it comes to where you live and where you’ve heard them.  Apparently I struck a nerve, lol. Taking one’s comments and twisting them to your liking for a debate doesn’t make you sound smarter, it makes you look desperate.  Since you didn’t read the post from the beginning last time, let me spell it out for you so that you can comprehend.  Best Buy Magnolia stores across the country uses a Plano for all of their displays. In fact all name brand stores do so.  No one is asking you to believe it or not but if you want to feel smart, look it up or ask your setup guys at Best Buy Magnolia.  I have a friend who is a Manager at the Magnolia store.  I don’t guess like some other people, I ask.  That’s how I know weather i like the sound from their display or not. Apparently you’re have an issue with McIntosh and the company model.  Last I checked they set the market for the audio world. I wouldn’t be silly or blind to think otherwise.  As for a million dollar system, I’ve embarked on that journey.  I have multiple systems in my homes. Not trying to brag but you went there, lol.  A true Audiophile person knows it’s not how much you spend, it’s what you achieve in buying the best gear for your environment to get what you PERCEIVE as the best sounding system for your home.  At the end of the day, it’s their money and who are you to dream otherwise. You don’t matter to them in their eyes.  One last thing,  I use McIntosh for my theater, that’s my theater and could care less about what you think.  It’s not my many two channel rigs.  My two channel rigs is far more advanced because that was my choice. I’ve volunteered many times in college at radio stations,  so trust me!  I know what great music should sound like.  At the end of the day, I would be honest with folks but I definitely wouldn’t bash their gear like you seem to do.  To me, that’s what people do when they can’t afford it themselves or lack self motivation to explore like some folks like to do, again it’s their own money, not yours.  That’s what I call ignorance thinking that you know what’s best for others!!

Detail, imaging, impact.  McIntosh is rather dull and generic sounding.  When you first hear it, you think, a nice and safe sound.  But then you compare it to other gear, and right away you hear its limitations.

I always say don’t use what you have in your main two channel rig for movies.  You won’t wanna watch more than one movie. Heck, you may just turn it off because it is screaming at you. It will sound lifeless and unpleasant because it’s way to detailed. It’s different from just listening to recorded or live recording music. You want your movie you are watching to feel more realistic and not too bright.  That’s why you separate the two in my opinion. My McIntosh theater is only for theater, nothing more..  I don’t use it for two channel.  I don’t expect everyone to have that option. But some folks love the sound of it I. A lot of folks use it if two channel.  Now in defense of McIntosh, I always here that people nag it and say, they only purchase it because of the beautiful blue meters.  Playing devils advocate, what’s the excuse of the ones without it?  As an audiophile, I can appreciate all types of audio equipment.  I don’t close my mind to any brand. As far as I am concerned, every company makes good and bad gear.  I don’t label one company as bad because they are the most successful and keeping smaller companies afloat by peaking one’s interest in the audio world. If they go down, sorry to say others will follow suit.