I've been thinking about the Power Regenorators. Are the really much more than AC/DC converter, connected to a Pure Sinewave inverter? I've been thinking about putting one together to see if there is a difference. Of course I would use high end units, thought about getting an inverter/charger and throwing a 3.4KW battery in the mix to take it out of the house circuitry all together, anyone have any thoughts on that? |
At axpona a couple years ago, D,agostino had three of the Stromtank units, one for each monoblock and one for the source gear. I wonder what the advantage would be with those monoblocks, I believe the power supplies are massive and regulated. |
In my system I’ve had the following over the last four years. Equi-Core 1800, an Older Shunyata Hydra 6, Niagara 5000, and a Puritan Audio 1512. I also have a Jackery Powerstation 500 battery pack that I use around the house. One day I decided to plug all of my source components in to it and was pretty blown away. Things became just a lot more relaxed and, for lack of a better word, whole. Soundstage depth increased a lot as well. Fast forward a year and I decided to take the plunge and buy a S1000 stromtank for the source equipment. I haven’t looked back. Works great with my system, but I would recommend auditioning if you can. Or you can even try a couple of batteries and inverter first to see what you think. Good luck. |
A year ago I got a extra bonus payment from work witch I had not seen coming upfront. I decided to dedicate the whole lot for my new hobby, HiFi. After some back in fourth I decided that I wanted to do something with my power both proctecting my gear and at the same give me clean relieble power. Long story short, I purchased a P12 regenerator. I plugged in all my gear both Parasound JC2, JC5, JC3jr,LuminT2 and SL1200G. The P12 handled all my gear as a walk in the park an the result??? Just immidiate more refined sound, more peace into the recordings and slam in the bottom.end. Total night an day different. Quite fun to see how voltage drops in my street when my neighbours are preparing for dinner with their family, but this does not affect me anymore with the P12. It has a massive coil and capasitors inside (hence weight) ready to feed amp when bottom end is asking for it. I was sceptical myself but Im suremy grandma could even hear the diffrence as it was present right out of the box. Ido live in europe thou so 230volts here witch also make the P12 alot more expensive with currency etc. Still worth every penny |
I tried many over the past 15 years and I landed on a newer designed PS Audio regenerator P-12 for my front-end gear and it is the best sounding one I’ve heard from any passive, isolation transformer design like the Furman Reference 20i which I liked a lot. Better than many branded audiophile ones with great marketing. The PS audio allows the music to flow, black background, more body and depth of field as well as imaging. It does what they claim it does, in fact when I run the vacuum on the same line as the PS Audio the meter goes way, way up on incoming noise and distortion at the very top of the range, but the regenerated AC shows only 0.1% distortion with the improvement meter, which shows almost 75 times improvement, I turn off the vacuum and the meters drop back down to 2.5% distortion in, 0.1% out. Voltage in 123 volts most days out a rock-solid 120 volts out.
This unit does as it claims and you can easily hear it. |
JRW-
I learned more in 5 minutes reading your reply than in 5 years
of reading reviews. Thanks!!
Now who has tried the Shunyata Everest??? |
JRW -
I agree with chorus that your response was excellent and very useful. Thank you - sincerely - for sharing your experiences.
The one important question I have for you (so I don't repeat the mistakes others such as you have made and learned from) is could you please name some or all of these "crappier conditioners" that crush the dynamics, etc.
I have read so many times about these issues, but it seems to always be in the context of a positive review or statement about "conditioner A", which DOESN'T screw up the current flow like others do. And I read this same thing about all of them! So, please do let me know which ones are actually crappy in your view. I will avoid them like COVID!
Thank you. |
Does Millercarbon own a PS Audio Power Plant 20 or is he relying on what he has read? I do own one and it made a huge difference in my system. I had a Niagara 5000 first and My ears liked the PP 20 better.
If you do want to read an article my I suggest Waiting for a bypass Analog Corner by Michael Fremer April 2021 Stereophile |
Michael Fremer lost his audio system to a switch for his back up power generator. While pending a separation of that power switch from his audio system, he installed PS Audio's power regenerator. The result is that he got his system back. Many audiophiles maybe suffering with bad power. Of course, battery only power is the best source but alternatively, providing clean power to one's system may require heroic/expensive measures such as regenerators and conditioners.
I have a pair of 125w. tube monoblocks that use a pair of 7" tall by 3" diameter electrolytic storage caps. I'm getting huge steady power in those amps. My EAR 890 has dinky little caps, not quite the bass power of the monoblocks but certainly adequate. I have a separate audio power panel so that could be a reason for the excellent amp power. |
rbyington711,
I also am fascinated by Mike Fremer's story. He said that the P20 + P15 restored his sound to the AQ 7000 level before the generator switch messed things up, but he implies that the P20 + P15 is no better than AQ. He hasn't decided whether to get the bypass switch that will enable him to use the AQ. If he does, then he will compare the P20 + P15 to AQ 7000 using the original power line.
Until then, can you be specific about what you heard from the P20 that was better than AQ 5000?
PS Audio seems to imply that their regenerated power is still a modified sine wave with slightly rounded tops and bottoms. The multi wave function may make the tops and bottoms more rounded and flat, making it a little like a square wave. which someone said dulled the sound. Inverters probably vary in their modifications of the perfect sine wave. Has anyone compared the Goal Zero Yeti 1000 inverter to the PS Audio? |
@atmasphere Ralph, what have you heard or have you tried the Puritan products? I put a lot of stock in your views, so I'm asking! |
Ralph, what have you heard or have you tried the Puritan products? I put a lot of stock in your views, so I'm asking! @hilde45 No, I haven't. I took a look at their website. IMO a passive product like this might have some audible effect, but without active circuitry won't regulate the AC line voltage, filter low frequency harmonics (the 5th in particular) and otherwise remove distortion of the AC line waveform. It does look like it would remove spikes and high frequency noise though. |
@atmasphere Thanks. Paul at P.S. Audio has made the case multiple times against passive conditioners for that kind of reason, and because he sells the very expensive regenerator I wasn't sure if his criticism against passive products went against them as a whole kind of product or just the ones out there now. But Puritan is relatively new, I think, so was kind of hoping Paul was wrong about this. It seems that he's not, at least if I am understanding the implications of what you're saying. |
Yes- although its possible to use ferro-resonant transformers to regulate line voltage, they also introduce harmonics and they can be pricey too if one of the lower distortion models. I've really not seen a decent conditioner that didn't have a lot of active circuitry inside.
BTW this is something that has been going on a long time. They were making power conditioners back in the 1950s that were all-tube, using a device called a saturable reactor. You have to imagine that if there was a perceived need 65 years ago that if it could be solved by a glorified power strip that that would have been done and everyone moved on to bigger fish. But here we are in the 21st century and quality power conditioning is still a thing.
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For under a $1000 the Audioquest Niagara 1200 made a huge difference in my system. Highly recommended.
I wasn't expecting much but it had as much or more impact as changing preamps or amps to bring the sound to life. |
When you strip away the marketing hype from Paul at PS Audio and live with their regenerators, I have owned the P20 for 2 years, and before that the P5, and before that the PPP, you realize they:
- produce line noise - the regeneration is not silent, or “free” - it does add some noise
- they are also susceptible to incoming AC noise. That’s why the power cord feeding the P20 maters. At times, there is more background noise in my system, which shouldn’t be the case if the output is “pure, clean” AC. The truth is that it is still starting with (dirty) AC, and some of that does come into the output
- a pure sine wave is not a requirement for equipment. It seems to make sense that a nice sine wave is important. But it’s not. Your equipment runs on DC and could care less about the incoming sine wave, as it’s flattening it anyway.
- they do nothing to filter noise being generated by your equipment, that gets put back into the line, and therefore affects other equipment
Don’t get me wrong, the PS Audio Regenerators do work, but they are not perfect. As was said a few times above, you have to listen and trust your ears. A PS Audio may be best for you, or a Shunyata Denali/Everest. These are the two leading contenders today. Audioquest has been surpassed by the latest advancements from Shunyata.
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