I just attended Axpona with Infigo Audio. I just wondered what was everyone’s overall thoughts. What systems , rooms, brand and experiences did you have? What are your likes, dislikes etc.
it was awesome to see the level of attendance, and feel the positive energy and obvious momentum in our hobby going on right now. i was only at the show from 9:30am-6pm Friday, and 9:30am-4:30pm on Saturday. my plan was to try and go into as many rooms as i could and get a feel for them by Saturday mid day, then go back to a few rooms Saturday afternoon and listen more. i decided what i could do to provide info those not able to come, was to take basic pictures of as many rooms as possible, then also take a picture of the room sign too for reference. this i could do in my process without slowing me down very much. with my limited tech skills it was doable. i did not hit every room for various reasons, whether too crowded, too loud, or my initial view of the gear. some doors appeared to be locked. i was very focused and decided not to travel with any group or listening partner as that slows me down.
i wanted to avoid the elevators as much as possible, so i started Friday morning on the 16th floor, and worked my way down to floor '11', then took the elevator to floor 7. at that point needed a break from the smaller rooms, and went to the main floor, and then over to the large rooms at the far end. then on Saturday started on floor 6 and worked my way down to floor 3. i must admit by the time i got to floor 4 on Saturday my focus to hit most rooms was spent. my tank was empty. so i just quickly did a few rooms on floor 4 and floor 3. then returned to some rooms i missed or wanted to hear again.
lots of good sound, and quite a few a notch or two better, then a few stand outs. it's important to note that many rooms could be pretty good assuming you played music that matched the room performance envelope properly. not every room could do all music properly.
Stand out rooms "special" sound---
-1620--Avantgarde/both with itron and Phasemation tubes. (great set-up Todd!)
-Club Lounge (15th Floor)--Gobel/Wadax/Riviera--liquid with rich textures. beautiful tonality.
-1210--darTZeel/Stenheim/+ Jerome Sabbagh live sax
--big Acora VRC speakers/VAC/SAT---with the SAT turntable. the next level lower with the digital.
-596--Cessaro/TW Acustic--High Water Sound---great musical connection. immersive, had flow and liquidity.
-592--Wolf Von Langa/Zeiler---great piano.
my two favorite listening moments were in the Gobel/Wadax/Riviera room and the Acora/VAC/SAT room (besides Jerome Sabbagh's "live" sax ).
a notch or two better than merely good-- pulled me more into the music.
-1628-Gauder/Soulution---especially tall ceilings, really even and tuneful bass for a small room.
-1632--Gauder/Soulution--larger room, very nice and balanced sound.
-1545--Rockport/Briscati
-1130-Airtight/Reed
-724-ADG productions.
-Schaumburg D-lobby floor.--Estelon/Vitus.
-Nirvana B--Credo/Emm Labs/Schroeder--spooky imaging.
-Nirvana A--Joseph Audio/Doshi
-1505--Artisan Fidelity/Tidal--sweet sound.
-476--Infigo/Alta Audio---outstanding digital sound.
good enough to be positively memorable---i liked it.
-1642--Rethm
-1627--Vivid
-1544--Marten/Constellation
-1428 Vinnie Rossi
-1416--Endow
-1403--Audio Note
-1229--Amphion/TEAC
-1223-PMC/Esoteric (had the T1 tt but did not hear it.)
-1245--Harmonia/Fyne
-1145--Porzilli Audio
-745--Cube Audio/Pass Labs
--664-Goldmund
--660-Garrard/Goldmund
--650-Tidal/Briscati
--646--Devore
--628-Leben--Tone Imports
--676-Clarisys/Hegel (very very slightly tipped up)
-530--Sierra/Aesthetix
-480-Ideon/JMF/Stenheim
-468-MSB/Magico
-448-Magnan Cables/Graham--relaxed, immersive
-428--AAD tape machine, Horst House tapes.
-Schaumburg B-Stenheim/VTL/dCS/Nordost (great sound but really tall ceiling so boomy bass).
--Wilson Sasha's/Moon Audio--liked it more than the other Quintessence rooms. seemed balanced. not too loud.
some good....memorable (or of particular interest)......but not entirely there
-709-Clarisys Minuet/VAC--a little tipped up
--Schaumburg H-lobby floor--ESD--big horns--playing too loud, and hard music to tell anything. might be great?
--Clarisys Auditorium/CAT--1st day---music with highs was tipped up, 2nd day seemed the same, then left quickly too loud. maybe on Sunday better? when they played Leonard Cohen sounded good as his voice has no upper octaves. YMMV. had a strong interest to investigate this speaker....expected that the CAT amps might = a great combo....but not when i heard it.
--Schaumburg G--T+A---might have been great but too loud.
The best axpona , I have a good time .I arrive 1 pm Friday I listen just a little bit, bought some music, 5pm done . Saturday I started listening from 1st floor to 7 th floor unable to listen to the floor up.I like the Borensen c1 speakers , Rhaido and Margules room. Quintessence set up in the lobby Wilson ALEXX AND DAN AGOSTINO MONO AMPS.
I was there Saturday and wasn’t able to see all I wanted but am glad i went.
The Estelon/Vitus was quite good - wish I had spent more time there.
The Auralic ESD horns I thought sounded “cupped” - typical horn colorations which surprised me. Not my cup of tea. And who could live with such gargantuan gear - even with a dedicated room?
The T+A room was playing their R2500 receiver which I thought quite good considering it’s an all in one. I have their HV gear and this was surprisingly good. It wasn’t too loud when I was in there.
I was disappointed in the TAD room as the bass was muddy and not showing the best of what those speakers are capable of.
Unlike Mike above, I found the darTzheel Stenheim room quite tipped up (unless there was another room w/ the electronics?). I really didn’t enjoy it. Must have caught it at a bad moment.
I thought ATC had a decent showing.
The new QLN w/ the Vinnie Rossi gear was just a bit bright of neutral, but sounded quite good overall.
Gobel/WADAX was very good considering the room limitations (wall of windows) with a smooth presentation.
Last year I thought the MBL room great - this year only so - so. But, it might have been the tracks. It just didn’t seem as well balanced. Still love the speakers and wish I had room for them.
Atmosphere amps - pretty darn impressive units and I may need to get a pair for a different rig.
I heard more, but these were the ones that made a lasting impression for me.
Very nice report summary you provided. From past experience I know the effort and concentration required to cover multiple rooms (Primarily CES days 🙂) as you did. Much appreciated.
I found all the Stenheim speakers Tipped up treble and bloated in the bass. None were impressive at all.
The Gobel/Wadax room is always disappointing as there is so much money there and some of the smaller systems sound way better than this room. People seem to get all goo-goo eyed about the expensive equipment - I went in Friday/Saturday/Sunday to see if the room was busy and it never was.
Vienna Acoustics room sounded really nice. It is great to see them back.
The Gobel/Wadax room is always disappointing as there is so much money there and some of the smaller systems sound way better than this room. People seem to get all goo-goo eyed about the expensive equipment - I went in Friday/Saturday/Sunday to see if the room was busy and it never was.
if you asked Elliot in the Gobel/Wadax/Riviera room, he would be the first to tell you that the room is a major problem. with windows all along the left side and alcoves everywhere it is impossible to get right, so even with taking 3-4 times the effort to try and mitigate that it’s still a problem for any high energy music. he tried to change rooms, but likely he will not do Axpona in the future with that room.
OTOH if you heard more small group or quieter music in that room it did have tonality and textures superior to other rooms i heard at the show. so i respect your comments that it had issues, but hearing music that the room could do it was superb. if you read my comments they were very limited, and i made a point of explaining that many/most rooms had limitations to what type of music would work.
the room is the thing. and gear can only operate with what a room allows it to do. you are correct that when people see the $$$$’s involved they expect that overcomes the room....but stuff does not work that way.
everyone loved the same gear at Capital Audio Fest with exactly the same gear and much less effort......as that room worked.
if you want to hear a room with Wadax that works perfectly you are welcome to visit me here in the Seattle area. i promise to make zero excuses. my room is fully sorted out. no one, and i mean no one, realizes more what a room can do or not do.....and then what room tuning can contribute. super duper gear can only take a great room further, not fix a problem room.
Sometimes I shake my head how they set up systems at Axpona. Many times expensive systems don’t even sound musical and involving. Yet they sound good. This year axpona after I listened to Borensen c1 monitor on the first floor? It became my reference. I like that system a lot very fast , good bass and amazing slam, palpability ,musical for my taste I love it. The one system that almost equal it is the Raidho and Margules combo.I don’t know if Mikelavingne listen to both system.Also Andrew Jones regardless of price? You know you will hear music music in his room.
@mikelavigneI have setup rooms in hotels as I belonged to a group of audio people who used to have their own little convention. THAT IS AN EXCUSE. Sorry, if I can setup a decent room at a hotel, then anyone should be able to. After all, that IS what these people do.
Then why were there also amazing sounding rooms with very little treatments? Their room has sounded bad every single AXPONA they have been at. Maybe get a different room?
Sorry, that is lame excuse and not something I take seriously.
That tells me all I need to know about presenter.
Doing the same thing over and over and expecting a different result is the definition of insanity.
See, now we have people attacking based on MY opinion. I write down my experiences in rooms, usually small descriptive phrases. In my opinions from the last few AXPONA’s it ended up being similar - recessed, not dynamic, lifeless.
Usually big speakers don’t do well at axpona compare to monitors.You don’t have enough time to treat the room and become familiar how ithe room and speakers interaction.Is it possible to be able to make the system sing ? Why not ? If the room size is right for the speakers. Example the Borensen room.I also notice the speaker placement is perfect. The Borensen crew know what they are doing. Plus they know how to showcase the system playing right music for the speakers .
Botrytis , Mike is not attacking you. He is asking how you will do it? MikeLavigne is not gonna do that to you.I have never seen Him attacking anyone in this site.He is always willing to share his knowledge as much as he could so the reader will benefit from it .I bet if you ask Him to listen to his amazing system more like you will be welcome.
@botrytis- as the owner of a pair of Marten Parker Duo's, I find your observation quite interesting and pleasing. I love how they sound with my gear in my room.
@larsman They were pleasing. The Borrensen C1's were also nice sounding.
@jayctoy I don't know the equipment, but if the room is an issue, maybe try a different room? I know that it is hard to get rooms. I am just saying other rooms with big speakers sounded good and with the amount of money in equipment in that room, I could buy my house several times over.
@mikelavigneIs a very passive-aggressive person - that is the type of query this was.
@mikelavigne Mike makes a great point. That point is that no gear on the planet can overcome a lousy room, plain and simple. Makes no difference how much money is thrown at the gear, if the room is lousy from an acoustic perspective, then the best one is going to get is what the room allows, and no more. This is why I always have a personal laugh at folks who spend big $$$ on gear and give little to no thought on where it is placed, and how the room it is placed in will work with said gear ( usually with no thought to what acoustic treatments will address). The forums are full of folk who have done this, ( not Mike L).
i absolutely respect any listening opinions and did not in any way claim you were wrong. i agreed with you. when i sat down to hear the Gobel/Wadax/Riviera room on Friday morning and heard it do energetic music it was a relative mess. the large speakers moved too much air for that particular room to handle it. you could listen around the room issues to a degree, but most listeners would not likely do that and would not be expected to.
and my original response stated that i respected what you wrote.
i’ll stop there, i’ve made my other points already. but please see that i was not claiming you were wrong.
Everyone. Rooms can be difficult but you gotta have good setup people and even though you might no be able to,overcome the room. You still have to work it. You have to have good set up folks with knowledge. You also have to brings things with you to try just in case.
Calvinj one more thing I notice the guys who operates the system at axpona don’t k now how to use the volume properly in regards to the size of the room.When they use higher volume then the room can’t handle sound bounce all over. This year some system they are using very low volume.You can barely hear and feel the music.
Yes they do that playing over and over again one album. I wonder what are they thinking Calvin.I mentioned on my previous post Borensen C1 room played different type of music, to showcase their set up ? It works.
@jayctoywe played everything in the Infigo Room. We played Bootsy, Gap Band, Human League, War, Pancho Sanchez, Hiromi, Fink, Ahmad Jamal, Lightnin Hopkins, Prince, Daft Punk. We jammed hard. We played some demo tracks too. But people want real music.
@jayctoywe will be at the California Audio Show. June 7,8,9. We will be at the Lone star Audiofest 7,8,9. In Dallas. We will be at the Pacific Audiofest in Seattle in September. We will be at Capitol Audiofest in Washington in November.
I think a great sounding treated room should be preferred but not necessarily required. There are some things in a system that it should just do regardless of the room.
@jayctoywe travel to shows all the time. We get great sound but we come with tools to adjust and the equipment performs and delivers which is the most important.
I was very much looking forward to hearing the Borresen's as I was unable to go to the Next Level demo a couple of months ago. Must be my 74 year-old ears, but I found myself physically wincing more than once while listening to the X1's (I think). That was a disappointment. On the other hand there were lots of great sounding speakers and many rooms were well set up. Several rooms had Magico's and they all sounded good. Something new: an Italian company called Turnbull. They had some stand-mounters with excellent sound, including bass. There also seemed to be quite a few open-baffle offerings that were good. I didn't keep good notes, but an example would be Pure Audio Project.
My taste runs toward the BBC sound and as always I enjoyed listening to some large Tannoy's, Spendor Classics and Hatbeth SHL's in various rooms..
A very useful show. I need to be more systematic about notes and pictures, though.
+1 @treepmeyeron the wincing! I thought I was the only one to find the Borresens a bit much. I have very resolving SS gear, yet still find these over-etched for me. Impressive in many ways yes. I actually enjoyed their smaller speakers more. By comparison the big Giyas with GTT's Audionet amps were stellar.
Fastfreight the Borensen c1 is really stellar. At times they play tune that are aggressive for others. If I ever buy those C1? They will suit me well. Jazz, classical music. Piano , vocal, rock like Bruce Springsteen album will work.Those agressive music they played are good for demo only.Those speakers will bring out what ever the source has.
"Borensen" Is this a new manufacturer as I have never heard ot this brand. They may run into some problems as the name is very close to Børresen, a brand from Denmark.
I didn’t make it this year but absolutely it’s all about the tool. Hotel rooms are terrible listening environments. The best i heard was about 5 years ago. Paradigm showed their new at the time Persona 7F (I think, possibly the 5F) with Anthem electronics and room correction. The room correction was vital in the setup.
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