DAC recommendation in 5 to 10K range

If you can wait, a used Brinkmann Nyquist 2 would be me recommendation.

My first impression was that it sounded like vinyl. 

Bob

The Holo Audio May KTE is in your price range.  I really like mine—very accurate and detailed while being incredibly musical.  You can find lots of reviews/accolades here and on other sites.

see the long Verdantaudio DAC thread here

May I ask what you are feeding your terminator? 

Personally, I have found the source to be as important as the DAC. Now, if you don’t care for the tonality of your existing unit, that is not likely to change with a better source, but some of the other elements could very well.  Then again, you might have this well sorted out already.  As the Terminator is well regarded, and I have never heard it suggested that it’s deficient in any way,  it may be that you just want a different flavor. Or it may be that you’ll benefit from feeding it a better source.

Of course, that does lead down a rabbit hole of sorts and you might end up searching for both devices and cabling, etc.  For example - I had a nice DAC but upgraded from a souped up and optimized Mac mini to a dedicated streamer which yielded a nice improvement.  I then went to a higher end streamer which again yielded nice benefits. That lead me to upgrade my DAC significantly, which didn’t yield as much improvement as I expected.  At least not until I upgraded the USB cable.  Then I changed the connection type (USB to stock Lightning Link “LL”).  Then I upgraded the LL cable and incorporated some network filtering.  All those changes yielded as much or more improvement than the original DAC upgrade. I’ve recently also added an upsampling processor so I’m still down my own rabbit hole but am ready to climb out.  Attention to source and these small details has yielded a digital front end that is fully competitive with some state of the art systems in direct comparison.

If you still want some DACs to consider in that price range that are different than your Denafrips, I can suggest you consider auditioning the Simaudio 680, and the Auralic Vega G2.1.  

Good luck,

May I ask what you are feeding your terminator?

I have a fanless server sending USB signal to the Terminator. The server is using i9-12900K CPU, and running Audiolinux as OS, HQPlayer as music player, using Taiko DC-ATX and an ULPS (Unregulated Linear Power Supply) as power source, signal output through JCAT XE USB card that is powered by Sean Jacob’s DC4 power supply, the output signal goes into Opto USB transmitter and then to Opto USB receiver, then going into Innous Phoenix reclocker before going into the Terminator, and the USB cable is Sablon 2020.

If you can audition a Meitner MA3 try ethernet from the server to the MA3.  Let the MA3 resample to DSD1024 before converting to analog.

If you can audition a Meitner MA3 try ethernet from the server to the MA3.  Let the MA3 resample to DSD1024 before converting to analog.

This is an interesting direction I have been thinking for a short while by getting a network capable DAC instead, and I may head in this way at some point.  Do you have any experience with this DAC having ethernet input from router/switch instead of server?

Have you tried changing filters or convolution with hqPlayer?  I have a Totaldac d1core that I love.  hqPlayer with convolution help to make up for room issues.  I used REW and rePhase with a umik mic.  Definitely not easy, there is a learning curve, but worth the effort.

This is an interesting direction I have been thinking for a short while by getting a network capable DAC instead, and I may head in this way at some point.  Do you have any experience with this DAC having ethernet input from router/switch instead of server?

I have a MA3.  Music is on a NAS or Tidal, inexpensive switch (I think MA3 forces ethernet to 100mbps for lower receiver noise).  Check emmlabs.com for a list of reviews under "news".

Given what you’re looking for I’d take a serious look at a Mojo Mystique DAC. It’s also an R2R DAC but possibly with a more organic kinda sound you might really like. Here’s a relatively recent review of one of their most recent models, but you can read others on past models to get a better idea of the overall sound characteristics of these DACs.

http://www.enjoythemusic.com/superioraudio/equipment/0221/Mojo_Mystique_EVO_B4B_21_DAC_Review.htm

Audio Note may be another make that might appeal to you as well.  Of course there are tube DACs too that probably lean more your way, but not sure if you’re open to going that direction.  My bias is to use tubes further down the chain if desired, but that’s just me.  Just another couple options FWIW, and best of luck.

I can highly recommend an Audio Research DAC 9. I have been a Audio Research fan for preamps and phonostages for decades. As my purchase ability increased I got better versions. But I never thought of them as a digital company although their DACs were top rated.

My dealer brought over a REF 160s amp for me to try (I was in the amp market)… he also brought over ARC DAC without me asking. I had an $18K DAC… and was not in the market. After demoing the amp… I realized, that although I really did not want to, out of respect for him… I needed to haul out the ARC DAC and try it. Literally, in less than 30 seconds I was typing a message to him to order me one. Never have I had an easier decision. Even though I had no idea where I was going to get the money… I am retired.

The ARC DAC is incredibly natural sounding and highly detailed. It puts out music… the sound that creates an emotional connection. It’s great having all these DACs that are highly detailed and “natural”… but this one connects directly with the heart.

My dealer brought over a Berkeley Alpfa Reference DAC ($22K)… I prepared myself to just say yes and later figure out where to get the money. Surprisingly after a couple weeks of comparing them, I actually preferred the ARC… although they were so similar that I doubt most folks could tell the difference in a couple days of comparing. The ARC was subtly more natural sounding and very similar in detail.

Chord Hugo TT2 is a good one in that range. Great headphone amp too. Might be able to score with m scaler for around $10k but I think Chord might have just bumped prices up.

Have you tried changing filters or convolution with hqPlayer?  I have a Totaldac d1core that I love.  hqPlayer with convolution help to make up for room issues.  I used REW and rePhase with a umik mic.  Definitely not easy, there is a learning curve, but worth the effort.

Yes on filters and modulators, but just now working on learning to use the convolution.  I plan to place an order for an UMIK-1 soon to start playing with REW, so hopefully I can have the same positive result you indicated.  Do you have any reading materials to suggest?

Of course there are tube DACs too that probably lean more your way, but not sure if you’re open to going that direction.

In fact, I do, Lampizator is on my short list to try and possible Aqua.

I can highly recommend an Audio Research DAC 9.

Thank you, I will check into this DAC.

I have had the Lumin u1 mini, A1, D2, and X1.  If you can find a used Lumin X-1 for under $9k end of the story.  IMO, is the best DAC/Streamer under $19k on the market.  I now have a Lampizator Pacific which costs twice as much as the X1.  To be honest there was not that much difference in SQ.  

The Lumin App is really user-friendly and you do not need Roon.  It is a great DAC.

we sell many great dacs if you WANT LIQUIDITY PLUS GOOD RESOLUTION

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Aqua fifi, naim, atoll, chord,ifi, bricasti dealears

I have had the Lumin u1 mini, A1, D2, and X1.  If you can find a used Lumin X-1 for under $9k end of the story.  IMO, is the best DAC/Streamer under $19k on the market.  I now have a Lampizator Pacific which costs twice as much as the X1.  To be honest there was not that much difference in SQ. 

I have heard good things about X1, and will see about finding a way to audition.

For just under 10k you can get a preowned Chord Dave.  awesome.

Lampizator Baltic 3 is very good in a different way than my Lumin P1, which is the new little brother to the X1.

Lampizator, Aesthetix and Brinkmann….. 3 significant genius dudes…..

Used DCS Bartok…? I had one and..well…kinda gorgeous! Might be at the top of your budget but I loved it….! DCS just released an firmware upgrade that I could hear. Lovely piece.

++Holo May. I have auditioned many DACs and is why I own a May. This includes offerings five times its price point. It is the best bargain in my journey thus far. The only knock is that is gets hot, class A hot. 

MSB Discrete.  I did not care too much for the tone of the Lumin X1, though soundstage was humongous.  MSB is so fluid and musical but very resolving.  Very easy to get lost in the music, as they say.

Another option you can consider is to add Gaia DCC to your Dac.

It will make focus sharp and treble more clean.

Thomas

don't listen to audio Troy they're just a bunch of product pushers of their own.

Try the Wyred4sound 10th anniversary dac, one of the most analog sounding dacs on the market at any price. one of the reviewers put it up against his VPI turntable with a $5,000 Japanese cartridge and he said it was every bit as analog sounding it's not cheap though it's $4,500 US and I bought one and I can totally agree with the reviewer it's the most analog sounding dac that I've heard in my system, I put it up against the $15,000 Sim audio DAC and the 10th anniversary dac was far superior, I have no doubt that this will be as good or better than the DCS as well.

MSB Discrete.

Try the Wyred4sound 10th anniversary dac, one of the most analog sounding dacs on the market at any price.

I have very good inputs from people regarding the higher price MSB DACs, but will look into MSB Discrete DAC as an option.  Thank you for the suggestion.

Not having too much inputs about Wyred4sound 10th anniversary DAC, certainly is an option.  Thank you.

I picked up a used MSB Analog DAC a year ago for under $5k and have not given DACs another thought. The first thing I played through it was Solitude by Francien Van Tuinen. My wife actually cried. That was a first.

Terminator 2 or Terminator Plus??

Just a thought.

OP,

I can understand wanting to go to a balanced output DAC,  but I have to ask what the DAC is plugged into?  Maybe your upgrade lies in the pre-amp? 

Regards,

barts

@elan120 Do yourself a favor and try to hear the Holo May KTE. Search YouTube for reviews. You will find head to head commentary on most of what has been suggested here. I have heard the MSB Discrete as well and it is decent but for me it was not as good as the May. It came close when you add the optional power supply, but that will put you north of your max price. Also had the X1 head to head in my home and it decently images but is far from an analogue sound. We found it sterile and far less engaging in comparison despite the separate power supply. Save yourself 5k and purchase decent cabling. I promise you will be as shocked as we were. The best part is that I think (at least the last I knew) there are no Holo dealers, point being you will find many "popular" brands suggested here because many have a stake in the game. I am NOT accusing anyone in this thread of this. It is only a note of caution based on my year here.  Regarding the ALL CAPS post in this thread... my comment is that I have heard the Aqua La Scala and it was one of the best for the price, but I still preferred the May. I have not heard the lavoice. There are diamonds in the rough and the May is hands down one of them. I am only taking my time to write this because it took me a year to select a DAC and I had 20k to spend on one. To date I only spent 1/3 of my budget for my entire system and if I had blindly went with the majority of suggestions here would have spent about 1/3 more than my total budget. I immersed myself in hifi for a year and almost drown. Multiple trips to dealers, countless reviews, and an amazing local audiophile circle of new friends who have the means and connections to cycle through tons of high end gear. My posts no longer come from that of a newbie. Sure, it has only been a year but I will argue and back everything I write with hands on experience. Did I want to spend money on a "remote" product? Absolutely not, but after research and the opportunity to hear it at a friend's house against a few others I was sold - jaw on the floor for the price, sold. I ask anyone here with suggestions if they have experience with the May KTE vs their recommendation? I would love to know and compare notes. Lastly, when you get to 5k and points north, many pieces will sound really good. It comes down to system synergy and audible preference. I have often found differences subtle, but those subtleties stack over long listening sessions. Point being that I recommend spending as much time as you can with each and try to avoid quick back and forth comparisons. Best of luck!

The Brinkmann Nyquist, which I own, is the most musical I’ve heard.  It goes to my VTL 6.5 preamp vis XLR.  It does everything you want plus, it’s available new at about $12k.  If you PM me, I’ll give you the name of the dealer I bought from.

@elan120 

https://rephase.org/tutorials/REW%20average%20measurements%20and%20impulse%20correction%20rePhase.pdf

https://community.roonlabs.com/t/a-guide-to-advanced-room-correction-with-rew-and-rephase-using-convolution-filters/90990

There's a ton on stuff on google.  I have found for me not to mess too much with th e results the software comes up with.  I do the measurements, set the parameters in REW, set the low and high freq rolloff.  Then export to rePhase.  In rePhase, I check the phase, which is usually fine if I don't mess around in REW and don't change the amplitudes in rePhase..  Then I create the filters.  Import to hqPlayer.  

OP,

I can understand wanting to go to a balanced output DAC,  but I have to ask what the DAC is plugged into?  Maybe your upgrade lies in the pre-amp? 

Regards,

barts

The output of the DAC goes into an Integrated amp, a Luxman L509X.

@izjjzi , Thank you for your detailed input.  I have direct experience with Holo DAC, but not the May, and I do plan to check it out.

@jgoldrick , Thank you for the two links and your simplified steps.  I didn't know about rePhase, with that, I think I am ready.  I placed the order for UMIK-1 and will see how things go when it is delivered.

I absolutely love my Weiss 501....has a great feature set, very flexible inputs and sounds sweet.

Elan,

I don't have the resources for the Terminator, but I do have a Denafrips Pontus II DAC. When I intially hooked it up to my old system using unbalanced Coax (no need to get into that), I too found the impact (attack) to be too laid back, soundstage was great width wise but not deep, and the highs were too laid back, a little sibilant, and treble to be slightly "veiled". I am using Buchardt Audio S400 MkII bookshelf speakers.

Since I was upgrading all of my components, I added a Denafrips Hades Pre-Amp and Thallo amplifier.....all of which are true balanced components. I hooked up the Pontus II to Hades Pre-Amp, and Hades Pre-Amp to Thallo amplifier with XLR balanced cables from Morrow Audio MA4 XLR cables....with 20 day burn in. I also swapped in Supra ethernet cables for the input to my Bluesound Node (3rd generation), and Supra USB from the Node to the Pontus II DAC.

Now since I changed so many components there, I am unsure which componenst/cables made the  most difference......but that fixed most most of my issues. The attack was improved, highs were more detailed and I feel like the "veil" has been removed, and the soundstage was wider and now deeper than with my previous set up. Also separation were improved.

I am going to reverse engineer to find out which made the greatest difference, but I assume using the Morrow XLR cables, using a Denafrips balanced stack connected via XLR, and the addition of the Supra cables all had a combined effect in the sound improvement.

Get a used PS audio DirectStream DAC and have the EDCOR XS4400 transformers installed by a local electronics shop.  It should be well under $5k.  Or, if you can wait, a new version of the DAC called the DriectStream MK II will soon be released by PS Audio.  Here is a link to some information on the transformer upgrade.

Give Lector-Audio made in Italy a look. I have their CD transport Digidrive TL-3 and have been very happy with the build quality and sound. They have a couple of DACs in their product line up. I bought my Lector from Deja Vu Audio which I believe might be the only dealer in America.

soix Given what you’re looking for I’d take a serious look at a Mojo Mystique DAC.

+1!

if you can get a used lumin x1 i would highly recommend in that price range

If your only interested in buying new, the Holo Audio May KTE is excellent 

Mearson DAC 1. Love my Mearson and I am quite impressed with my neighbors Simaudio 280D. 

Aqua la Scala would be a good choice, that would match your expectations.

Worth giving it a try.

The MSB Discrete is a game-changer.  Highly recommend.

I am very happy with the PS Audio DirectStream DAC.  I took advantage of the try-at-home time to evaluate it against some other DACs like the Benchmark DAC 3 and pro-ject DAC which I was previously using.  I did not compare it to the May or terminator DACs since there was no local dealer or way to try those out.  I was looking for a new DAC instead of a used DAC to get the latest technology.  I like the ability to get software updates to change/improve the DAC in the future.

(At the risk of a repost - think I accidentally deleted my post, before it actually posted)

You may want to look into a used Mola Mola Tambaqui. Many will tell you there’s a trade-off between having a fluid/musical/don’t-worry-lose-yourself presentation, and a higher resolution, truer-to-the-recording presentation. Bit of an oversimplification, for my money the most musical presentations are from systems that have “true” high resolution (you can hear deeply into the recording but the sound isn’t etched with artificial contrast, and there’s not distracting over emphasis on certain aspects — everything is balanced).

I’ve found that the Tambaqui achieves that balance really well, across different systems and rooms, it’s got very high yet natural resolution, significantly more present dynamics than the R2R digital I’ve owned, and yet allows me to forget the system and just enjoy myself. It’s not a universally “relaxing” presentation, though - relaxing recordings are relaxing, and adrenaline-pumping music will pump your adrenaline.

Have you checked out the Denafrips Terminator Plus? Its the bigger brother of Terminator 2 and gets amazing reviews all around. Beats out Holo May KTE

https://www.hifi-advice.com/blog/review/digital-reviews/spdif-dac-reviews/denafrips-terminator-plus/

+1 @mark360 I've heard the Lector gear also at Deja Vu also excellent sounding Dacs.

@tahsin1022 Please show me a review where someone prefers the terminator plus over the May KTE. Not being snarky, I would love to see one because I have not yet come across such. Thank you.

@elan120 This is one of the best DAC reviewers I've found. He reviewed many of the DACs mentioned in this thread in a way that you will not see anywhere else and with actual music samples demonstrating, yes demonstrating the differences between them. He did like the Terminator Plus, but at the end of the day, the May KTE remains his reference piece.