Solid State Phono Stages

Seems like you will have to buy about a half dozen phono stages in order to appease the crowd, and then listen to them in your system in order to make your own decision. I am being only half facetious. Sometimes you really do have to buy several different versions of the same thing in order to figure out what you like. In your case, you already do have a backlog of experience with many tube and SS phono stages. It is my sense that the best tube and the best SS phono stages have tended to converge upon each other over the last 10 years; it is no longer justifiable to think of tubes as "warm and rolled off" or SS as "cold and analytical". As Mr Prentice already said.

@ghdprentice I understand what you are trying to say. But I am in the camp that believes that a component can be analytical and be incredibly musical and enjoyable. Advanced technology can now afford this to us, where resolution so clear and dissectable can be delivered to us in the most effortless and pleasing ways. The Mola Mola Tambaqui DAC is a great example of this. It is probably one of the most musical and analytical components combined. I’ve also owned the Ref 6 and Ref 150 SE, which are fairly recent ARC reference pieces. They were both musical, but largely more analytical, especially for tube. You’re right that the divide is narrowing, but many will still agree that the latest ARC is analytical.

It’s funny how a word’s definition and connotation may change over a generation. People used to generally associate analytical with bone dry, providing clarity into the music at the expense of delivering emotion and understanding soul. Today, data is the silent language of people, and artificial intelligence mines it to make technology be more human. Hence, analytics is starting to understand and mimic soul. The same is happening for audio. This is precisely why I fell in love with T+A. Their Hv line has the soul that is typically associated with the very best tube gear, but the “blackness” from its incredible resolution and high SNR allow listeners to truly both analyze and feel the music in parallel.

With this in mind, I’d say I’d like to remain curious about the Ref 3 Phono. :) I doubt I will ever buy it, but I would never say no to an opportunity to listen to it, especially in my own system.

@lewm I initially posted this before reading your most recent post, but now that I did, I think you and I are on the same page, so this applies to you as well.

An experienced ear knows what is making a good impression with an immediacy.

Spending time at an event can introduce encounters to devices of interest that are on a shortlist or not.

When an attractor is encountered it is known in an instance, the next hurdle is to learn of how the device is able to be home auditioned.

Laying out considerable sums of money is not necessary to encounter a variety of Phon's.

Selecting a excursion to a event and having a social interaction is a very enjoyable way to make new discoveries and indelible memories.  

Well you could look for a pair of Krell KPA s you want two of them so you can run them true dual mono. You want a pair of them if you want exceptional. 

Regards

I have the simaudio 610 with the clear audio performance dc and I'm really happy with it- very quiet, plenty of detail and great mids. I assume the 810 is similar except better. Either would be a good choice. 

@thiefoflight , all that is old tech. The PC-1 is a very low impedance cartridge. If you want to get the most out of it you want a Transimpedance or current mode phono stage. Examples are the Sutherland Loco and little Loco, the BMC MCCI and the Channel D Seta L or Lino C. I just ordered a Seta L Plus to use with a Lyra Atlas Lambda SL.

@pindac - 100% agree that real world experience is invaluable. I will be attending AXPONA, but it will likely not be a great place to get the most out of phono stages. When I went in 2019, there surely some rooms, but most focused on the proliferation of digital. Also, the rooms and system chains are always different, so chances are it won’t sound anything like it would in my room. I would have to draw conclusions and hope for the best. I have also reached out to my personal network, who has allowed me to try a number of SS stages. But it never hurts to gain perspective from forums as well. What’s happening on this thread may influence me, but won’t solely convince me of any decision. Likely what will is if I can get to a dealer that has one of the top units of consideration and they allow me to demo at home, or if one of those units comes on the market considerably marked down so that I can resell at minimal loss. The latter makes up for most of my audio journey, and it’s been fun to have all the experiences I’ve had as a result, and at times it has even been profitable.

@kerrybh Thanks for advocating again for Simaudio.

@mijostyn Vinyl in general is old tech, as is my cart, but circuit design has evolved in nuanced ways over the last ten years to innovate and outperform, just as it did the ten years prior to that. It was really only the late 70s to mid 90s that went backwards for many (albeit a small few that carried the torch) where 2nd order harmonics were largely given up for specs, and high SNR and CD players became centers for marketing attraction and pushed musicality out of the way. In today’s era where people seek true holography in their experience, both need to coexist, and the tech has gotten better to enable that. Yes, some of the products I’m considering are already ten years old. But perhaps they address areas that compliment the rest of my room and system setup to get me further down the road.

Absolutely love the suggestion for Sutherland and Channel D. I mentioned prior that they are high on the consideration list.

Graham slee Era Gold V. Moving magnet only, but you can step up a moving coil with an appropriate SUT. Michael Fremer seems to like it a lot. I bought one a few years ago, I opted for the stereo/mono switch option. It is very nice. I use both a Jensen and Rothwell SUT with mine, depending on which MC cartridge I have installed at the time. Pair the Era Gold V with the Graham slee PSU1 power supply for even better performance. 

Michael Fremer in Stereophile calls it a "miraculous phono preamp" for its ability to change and dramatically lift an entire system’s sound quality and make music sound more realistic and life-like!

My experience is all about being social and interactive with other enthusiasts.

HiFi is a diminishing concern when the younger generations are considered, and I am happy to support any event that might attract some of the younger individuals, as well as be a face to be met and supply support to any queries presented.

Also through this behaviour to get out and interact, I have been fortunate to have come to know accomplished EE's that are not only adept followers of circuits, but known for being accomplished as circuit designers and have designed works for known Brands as well as take on commission builds bespoke produced to the customer.

 A few of these EE's have progressed to having their own growing Brands of which some the sale items have even got a mention on this forum, not too bad for a modern UK Brand. 

It is a nice moment for an individual, when a Company Owner values your own assessment and is keen to receive an evaluation of a work in hand. This is even more of a moment when the designer is willing to loan a prototype for a prolonged assessment.

Most of my devices I own today are commission built or known Brand Models that are subsequently given as a donor to be overhauled by known individuals who specialise with such products.

As I have been instrumental in participating with the majority of my devices that are commission built, it is not a option to have a home demo', but as I have been assessing the work, produced at different stages, and a participant in the trialing of and the selecting of components, I have a very good idea of the SQ being developed for the devices.

This is a method that has suited me, as not only have I acquired items I am making old bones with, and do not intend on separating from, the friendships formed and maintained are as healthy as the admiration of the products produced. 

I would use the dealer rooms to see products, the real benefit is looking to see if it is possible to be meeting with the individuals responsible for a design.

There is the likelihood, when they are met, they can see a real enthusiast is in their presence, and this can be good as there will usually be a meeting where the individual will be quite willing to exchange dialogue.  A event can be a good place to encounter these types of individual.

At the last public event I attended prior to COVID, a similar dialogue developed between a room visitor and a EE who I was with, with the result being a follow up meeting was arranged and a Bespoke Built Phonostage was produced for the individual based on the standard design being demonstrated during the event.

Whatever method is adopted to encounter products of interest, a product tailer made to to deliver the majority of ones own preferences is not too bad a place to arrive at either.  

+1 @pindac! Wonderfully said. I would say that in both cases, either across industry events, working directly with manufacturers, and buying/selling on the used market has expanded my network in ways I value sometimes more than the gear I end up getting.

While I am curious about SS stages, one of the reasons I love my Modwright PH9.0X (aside from the fact that it kicks serious butt) is my multi-year engagement with Dan Wright. He has been an incredible designer and engineer that listens and provides impeccable guidance. He has designed some products around my needs.

I always tend to find myself keeping in contact with anyone I buy and sell from as well, and the perspective gained from that is priceless. It's unfortunate that forum dialogue and interaction doesn't result in the same level of real-world relationships.

@thiefoflight  …”But I am in the camp that believes that a component can be analytical and be incredibly musical and enjoyable.”

ok, we definitely are talking about definitions.. Maybe it is just because I am an old fart, but analytical to me means overly detailed… achieved by less midrange and bass bloom… causing a highlighting of detail… which always comes at a loss of warmth and generally musicality. It is like slam which is increased by reducing midrange and upper bass… the contrast highlights the fast transient bass (something ss is good at). But the downside is you loose bass resolution.
 

To me you are talking about wanting a detailed musical system… the thing ARC is known for. Analytical has bad connotations to me.

@ghdprentice We're understanding each other. Musical and detailed to me also has bad connotations. For me, analytical allows me to "see" into the music. Being detailed is not always good if the detail is not being presented well. If it's just in your face without grace, the listener has no focal point and it all falls apart. That's probably what you associate as analytical. But the true root of analytical is something that can be analyzed, so delivery and presentation matters a lot. This topic is something that has caused divide across the community for so many years, even generations, and hopefully one day it will be bridged. I, too, don't want to associate myself as a typical "analytical" listener, but I won't deny that I want to hear it all, and hear it all with grace and soul.

Enthusiast evolve in their understanding of how to listen to music analytically and for pleasure.

Enthusiast also evolve in their understanding of how the system in use works as an entire set up. The enthusiast will have a good grasp on where the system is in terms of the performance on offer and where they might have a want for it, as it is not quite able to deliver in a certain frequency or perception to the owners unique preferences.

Engineers evolve as well, their hands on experience and interactions hone the skill set, and the hooks that adopt to eek the best out of a circuit becomes their signature.

Keeping in contact with an individual who has skills that one can only dream off acquiring and also one that has a trust in you, at times inviting you along for ypur thoughts to be shared and showing a dependence on your own experiences, is a great place to be. I would not change a thing.

Andy Groves who is the Head Engineer in Audionote and possibly is executive in the Company was the designer of my first owned SS Phonostage.

Andy was also instrumental in the design of my first Valve Power Amp.

Both of these designs introduced me to an EE who I am still good friends with today and we are at present doing a project together once more.

Andy now uses Panzerholz as part of the structure for certain Audionote Circuits, the material might even be used for all the products created at present.

Is this a circuit improvement electronically or is a structure that improves the circuit when in operation ?? It is a hook and is born as an idea and then curiosity has yielded the result where the method is seen as worthwhile and to part of a design.

My own Engineer has developed hooks and he is quite protective of these, he has always requested that I do not make knowledge of his IP known, which I have faithfully honoured.

Another Electronics Engineer friend who has produced Pre Amps and Phonostages,  felt that his HiFi system was maxed, and there was no need to add a device of any type.

They were curious about the interfaces for the umbilical's.The individual has high quality Cables and RCA Plugs, and focused on the Chassis Sockets, as the next parts to be considered to be exchanged.

The swap of the Sockets to another brands Chassis Mount Sockets blew him away at the improvements on offer, I have heard this exchange of parts and the change is detectable and is a method I will be adopting.

Keeping the curiosity and interest is important and being broad minded will go a long way. A look at the simpler things in the system can yield the levels of change in a system, that some part with extortionate amounts of monies to try to correct. 

@thiefoflight 

I hope i did not offend you as that wasn't intended. The problem with forum threads is that it often becomes my latest is the best and i will talk about it until i get the next item.

roy gregory who was at hifi plus did a series of very good reviews around 15 years ago - many of the units are still in production such as the EAR, Boulder and Tom Evans.

If it were my money - BOULDER; WHEST - 

If I could afford it constellation - also consider parasound jc3 - i heard one in a parasound system - i have both a whest and vendetta in my system - love them both

@lohanimal Not offended and agree with you that written communications on forums can be misconstrued given lack of supporting tone at times. I, too, was just further stating my case in my response. Good to hear your recommendations, they are appreciated. 

Two sleepers from me: I run a Zyx Universe CU24 on a Dynavector arm through a Bobsdevices Altec TBB103 SUT to a Zyx Artisan, which is not a universal tool but through its battery supply very quiet and with the Zyx cartridge beautifully neutral and musical

I also run a Scheu MC (Benz modification) on a Mørch arm through a balanced connection to an Aqvox 2ci. This combo is punchier but less musical than the Zyx, more for rock music whereas the Zyx shines on classical. The Aqvox in balanced mode is very impressive but doesn’t match the Zyx as well as the Artisan.

musical surroundings phenomena II plus with linear charging power supply.

This combo sounds much better than it's price would suggest.

See Herbs report in stereophile

@thiefoflight 

hi. I can only say the Tom Evans for solid state are really fantastic. Groove SR used or a regular groove new easily 5-8k or less. I have heard them and two fantastic ears (big time reviewers)  in the industry have them in their systems. VTL tp 6.5 series 1 used or a new VTL tp 2.5 is 5k. I think VTL wastes AR not only in their phono (which is their specialty) but also their amps. Bea Lamm only listens to vinyl and she is the ears behind VTL. My  S-400 series 2 amplifier by VTL is absolutely incredible. World class. I think there is a used mastergroove SR for sale on the web.

@thiefoflight 

You’re probably right about me keeping the PH9.0X. Even if I did buy a solid state stage, I’m not sure I would let go of it. As a tube unit it has bested some Allnics, the Herron VTPH-2A, the Rogue Ares Magnum, and Fosgate Signature Phono.

The ModWright PH9.0X bested the Herron VTPH-2A? Not trying to start a fight just gob smacked curious? Can anyone else testify? Thanks

@tyray I don’t think anyone else on this thread makes a direct comparison, but lots of useful info here. I participated in this thread as well, and Dan Wright too commented.

https://forum.audiogon.com/discussions/herron-vtph-2a-vs-modwright-ph-9-0

The Paradox Phono 70 Signature phono preamplifier is a sonic bargain, but has very limited adjustments.  Very positive online reviews.  Not sure if too powerful for your PC1 cart.

I just moved from an Aesthetix Rhea Sig to the Pass XP-27.  Honestly I could not hear significant difference except Pass is quieter.  Very happy with XP-27 and love not having to worry about tubes.

+1 for a transimpedance stage. With a 2.5 Ω impedance your cartridge is a perfect candidate. I had Esoteric e-02, Allnic 3000, and also had the Sutherland Loco. I've also had a Channel D Lino C which was good but not as good as the others, but it has been a while and it was an earlier model so can't really compare it. The Loco is balanced in but can be used with RCA-XLR adapters or the input jacks can be changed to RCA. I’ve talked to Ron Sutherland about and he is OK with the mod if done with quality connectors by a qualified tech... it is very easy to do.

But I sold it in favor of the B.M.C. MCCI Signature ULN - Balanced Moving Coil Phono Amp. At basically half the price of the Loco I preferred not only for sound but it is much more flexible in terms of gain, RIAA selection, and a few other options. It does require XLR in so quality adapters would be needed unless you change your cable.

http://bmc-audio.com/index.php/bmc-phono-mcci-30.html

Ron Sutherland is a great guy, and all he does is design phono stages. I would challenge the thought of having a long cord between the phono stage and the preamp though. You want cables to be as short as possible. If you don't need balanced/XLR, that opens other options for you like the Sutherland DUO. Plus you'll save a nice chunk of change. Also, van den Hul should be on your list.

I'm not going to recommend one, but I have never heard a tube phono stage that did not hiss, even if slightly, and not one quiet enough for a low output MC cartridge.  If anyone knows of one, I'd like to know

Sutherland is the quietest phonostage I’ve ever heard. 

There are quite a few very good phono stages ad there are a handful of really special ones.

I have one of the first sort that uses tubes in one system (Conrad Johnson Premier 15). It is very good.

I have a solid state phono stage in my other system and it is the best I have ever heard of any type (Vendetta SCP2 -C). But good luck at ever finding one.

For $2,200. the Musical Fidelity M6x Vinyl is a fine phono pre. Balanced, adjustable to ANY cartridge. Sounds fantastic. I am running a VPI Classic with a Sumiko Pearwood. Everyone that hears it thinks it's great. 

Another recommendation for Sutherland Transimpedance designs. Just transcending in all aspects. For me, it was revolutionary in that my poor recordings became amazing! It really gets to the heart of the recordings. Any in the lineup exhibit this behavior, but you of course, get more as you move up to the higher end Little Loco or Big Loco.

For reasons to numerous to go into here you might consider a Black Swan Phono Preamp.

There is a SIMAUDIO MOON 610 for sale right now on Canuck Audiomart for 8K

@herman I just came across the MCCI Signature ULN myself two days ago and was very intrigued by it! Can you share where you got yours from? I can’t find any dealers in the USA and I trued contacting BMC directly and did not get a response. 

There is a Phon' that there might be a opportunity to experience in the USA and one that I have received an audition of on a few occasions.

Also it is one that I know is owned in the UK and has maintained a very loyal following, especially when owners have had it compared to very expensive Phon's in their own systems.

My most memorable experience of the Paradise Phonostage has been at a Bake Off event where the host has a system worth approx' £200 000,  one of the UK's renowned builder of the Paradise design was present with their personal model.

The event usually does Valves / Valve Hybrid and Solid State as their own sections and these models are presented in groups governed by Purchase Value. 

The Paradise was entered into the Bake Off at a particular Purchase Value range and was speedily removed from the demonstration by the host of the event, to be entered at a much more expensive purchase price for the Phon's.

When used at the lower purchase value demonstration, the Paradise was noticeably streets ahead in its qualities.

It can be stated that Phon's from a certain price range can sound quite similar and only really separate in their perfomances, if a certain frequency is noticeably accentuated during the performance. I put this down to very similar Topologies for the circuit designs used.

In the end Six Phon's were side by side with the most expensive having a  Purchase Value of £10 000, interestingly a very rarely encountered Modwright 9.0 Valve Hydrid Design was in this selection.

This selection was trimmed to the Paradise and the Music First Reference going Head to Head.

A Commercial £10 000 Phon' ( Music First Ref ) and Bespoke Kit Built £2500 Paradise.

Each are quite unique and not with the same sonic traits as many Phon's in demonstrations had shown previously.

There was a split between the selection and the attendees who were deselecting Phon's throughout the day were not unanimous in their choice, there was no clear preferred choice.

I could have quite happily spent many many hours with either.             

I second Variat on the Whest gear.

I have had a couple of their offerings; currently using a customized PS30 RDT SE which James built for me two years ago using mostly PS40 RDT parts put into a surplus PS30 case and a customized input on one setting for my vintage AT20ss MM.

This phono stage is simply outstanding, way beyond several other well-known names mentioned here which I have owned. The Whest preamps are simply superb.

At this time I am using an Ortofon A90 MC with it, not the AT20ss.  It is just simply jaw dropping how good this sounds.

 

I just came across the MCCI Signature ULN myself two days ago and was very intrigued by it! Can you share where you got yours from? I can’t find any dealers in the USA and I trued contacting BMC directly and did not get a response.

http://www.aaudioimports.com/

https://10audio.com/bmc_mcci-uln/

Love or hate Fremer, he liked it, and this was before the signature version

B.M.C.'s Phono MCCI is exceptional, and easily among the best, if not the best, MC phono preamps available today at any price. Its sound was startlingly good, and in some ways seemed to surpass that of virtually every other phono preamp I've heard, especially in terms of transparency, and of not imposing its own strong character, or any character, on the music.

@herman many thanks for having me revisit aaudioimports.com. I tried before from laptops and the site wouldn’t load for me, but today it worked on my phone. I’ve sent an email to the distributor to inquire. 
 

For others commenting on Whest, Music Direct has the PS 40 SE for $7500, which is a good deal for open box but still doesn’t have me convinced. It would still fall a little beyond my stated budget. 

I picked up the Rega mini phono recently for use on digitizing vinyl as well and gotta say for less than $200 it is pretty darn good.  Also very well reviewed which is why I tried it first before sinking more $$$$$s into a new phono setup.  Recommend trying the Inexpensive Rega phono preamps to start.  Nothing to lose.  Available from many vendors with very good return policies which is very important when trying out new gear. 

I own several turntables and cartridges, which I alternate with different phono stages and step-up; I have been using both a Pass Xono as my main phono preamp for many years and I have not noticed the characteristics exhibited by the opener both a Camtech Phono and an Audio Analogue Aria rev. and I must say that both the Xono and the Camtech have slightly different sonic characteristics and that I appreciate both, I do not feel the need to change for now because I am satisfied.

I might suggest that the opener try listening to FM Acoustics if he gets the chance.

So just to update this thread, I’ve made a few decisions and settling on two phono stages actually.

The first is on the Audionet PAM G2 with outboard EPC power supply. Should go perfectly with my cartridge, and the engineering of the unit fascinates me. 260,000uF of capacitance reservoir is more than my power amp’s separate power supply. 
 

The second one will be the BMC MCCI Signature ULN, which will be coming from Germany likely in mid-to-late May. This is a “transimpedance” / current injection stage as some have pointed me to in this thread. 

The Sim Audio MOON 610LP and 810LP are still on my “itch list”.

I likely won’t be able to post impressions on the Audionet for another week or so, but excited to compare against the Modwright PH 9.0X.

Thanks all, for being a great community to enrichen my audio journey. And stay tuned!

I used to have an Xono before moving to the XP-15. I currently have the XP-17. While I loved the Xono, the later Pass phono stages are head and shoulders above it.

I don't think you can get an XP-27 for $8K, but if you can find it at that price I would jump all over it.

An alternative would be to get the XP-17 and put the rest of your dollars into a good/better interconnect and power cord. (And/or upgrade your phono cable.) Those improvements will yield a significant improvement as well.

@jpan The following statement is valuable advice and one that has been experienced by myself today whilst visiting a friend whose designs for HiFi equipment has won much favour.    

"An alternative would be to get the XP-17 and put the rest of your dollars into a good/better interconnect and power cord. (And/or upgrade your phono cable.) Those improvements will yield a significant improvement as well".

My friend has adopted the use of cables using PC Triple C Wire since my introducing these to the system they own.

This friend has also assisted me in my request to have a Tonearm Produced using PC Triple C Internal wiring. There is now after a few attempts and some extended  trials a Tonearm produced into its final guise using PC Triple C Internal Wiring.

Today was about using my owned PC Triple C wire as a DIN>RCA Cable and as a RCA>RCA Cable and the system owners acquired cables with the same wire in the system with the new internal tonearm wire.

To add a curve ball, I also brought along a Power cord / lead made form the same wire and other RCA >RCA  Interconnects that are produced using D.U.C.C wire.

We both have the same TT's and Tonearms and a selection of Cart's attached to same material headshells.

My friend had a 'Old friend cartridge' that he has not owned or used the model for a very long time, but had recently acquired as a model with a sale description that it has close to a 1000 hours of usage on it,  and it was purchased as a Cart' to be a donor to go for a overhaul, to give more expensive owned Cart's a break from usage.

The Cart' in question is a Ortofon Kontrapunkt B (Kb), I own good condition spares of these Cart's,  as well as a model that has been completely rebuilt.

The idea was to work our way through trialling Cables and exchanging Cart's up to the Ortofon Windfeld.

The Plan did not quite go as organised, after a couple of cable configurations, the so called worn out Kb, was superb with a couple of Cable configurations and not quite the same match with other configurations.

The suggestion was made to add the Power Cord / Lead to the Phonostage, which when done was quite something, there was a noticeable change for the better and the Power Cord was agreed to be kept in place.

The Cable of the day in my view was a RCA > RCA SAEC SL-5000, when in use with the Internal Arm Wire and the Power Cord, the SL-5000 delivered in a way that was quite unimaginable, bearing in mind the Cart' in use was supposed to be a donor for a refurb, not one of the attendees wanted the Cart' to be changed, the want was strong to see what was on offer from it from all the LP's brought along .

I have a very little use Kb' that is un-mounted and stored, it has been agreed this Cart' will be brought along for the next session arranged for June and will be compared to the Cart' used today, if it still has wind in its sails, my suspicion is it has been a Lazarus today and has many hours of usage left to go.

Do I regret not trying out different Cartridges, not at all, and as far as I can tell no one else is feeling something was missed either.

The Cables selected allowed a Cart' that was expected to be underwhelming experience to shine and be a Cart' that generated a very positive impression.     

Dear @thiefoflight  : Congratulations.As with any audio item almost always exist a " but " and in your unit is that's weird that the RIAA deviation ( that's the main critical characteristic along gain for a phono stage. ) has a swing of 0.4db ! and even the manufacturer does not disclose rthe RIAA deviation at 20hz but from 40hz and up. It's normal that if has 0.4db at 40hz then at 20hz could be higher. Not a good thing for an item with its " pedigree " level. Yes, is high for a unit coming from that manufacturer. 

Anyway, enjoy it,

R.

Hey @rauliruegas - thanks for your thoughts and making me look into it. Are talking about the BMC unit? The Audionet claims +-.2db. While the BMC doesn’t list the spec, they publish the chart, which is almost completely flat (0db deviation) from 60hz on. They also explain their theory on why RIAA equalization in general can be inaccurate, and that additional adjustments can be made to compensate for low bass. I will not get this unit until late May likely. 
 

OTOH the Audionet PAM G2 with EPC power supply is well above and beyond the performance of the Modwright PH9.0X. There is an absolutely beautiful weight and bloom and tone, more so than the Modwright. The soundstage is wider and imaging outlines are more precise. The Audionet is above and beyond quieter. Bass control and amount is significantly better.

I’ll be putting the Modwright up for sale in the coming week or so. It is by far an incredible stage for the price, but I seem to have found a successor in the Audionet, and we’ll see how the BMC performs in a month or two. 

OK, kudos to the OP and contributors on this thread. Unlike some threads that get really “weird” this discussion has been conducted with politeness and constructive give and take.

Nice!!

@photomax,

Well said.  This has indeed been a very instructive and informative thread free of the destructive degeneration of most threads on Audiogon these days - kind of what it used to be like around 10 years ago.  

OP, keep us updated.

@photomax I appreciate your call out very much, thanks. I was worried it might go that route myself and glad it did not. A somewhat fitting statement, someone I work with introduced me to “The Platinum Rule”. Where the golden rule says to treat others the way you would like to be treated, the platinum rule says to treat people the way THEY want to be treated. Very subtle difference that requires an extra ounce of awareness for others’ needs. If this is how every forum went, we’d all be much further along on our audio journey!

@thiefoflight to discover a device that surpasses and supersedes a trusted device is usually a knock one out the ballpark experience, and only being their can really describe the impact that is made and good impression left.

I have had this twice with Two Phon's across a few years, one that was built for me by the designer who was initially offering it as a kit to be assembled, this was very special and won my favour and others who experienced it, following a Tube Rolling experience, I thought I was finished with the search for  Phon'.

A friend attended a Phonostage Bake Off with myself and demonstrated a Phon' he had produced, and when it was given its demonstration, it was a show stopper.

I was supplying parts and a critical ear during this Phon' design rethink.

The end product took on a few guises throughout a period of a year and the latest design produced solely by this individual is owned by myself.

It is a amazing piece of kit to use, and my search is I believe for now over, whilst my ears are functioning as they are at the present.

The designer is now involved with producing Phon' designs for a well known Company that specialises in ancillaries for TT's.

Enjoy the new information to be revealed from the groove and the wonderment that can follow.  

Noise in the older ARC phono stages is almost entirely tube dependent. You really have to get now noise tubes then they are as quiet as a tube stage can get. They are also hybrid with a FET front end. 

The quietest phono stage made by a longshot is the Channel D Seta L20. It can be run either current or voltage mode. It is also something like $60,000 and out of my price range. But, Channel D's Seta L Plus is the second quietest phono stage made and can also be run either current or voltage mode. It has a battery power supply and an extremely accurate RIAA circuit. It also has a flat output if you care to try digital RIAA correction. At about $10,000 it is manageable. I find it intriguing enough to buy it sight unheard. Both Stereophile and Absolute Sound raved about it's little brother, the Lino C. 

@lewm, Schroder will only use captive cables. He will supply them RCA or XLR. It is a breeze to swap connectors, maybe 20 minutes with a soldering iron. Sota will be displaying their Nova and Cosmos tables with Schroder arms now. I wonder whose fault that was. Anyway, you know how I feel about unnecessary contacts in the way of a phonograph cartridge signal. 

@pindac it's amazing what system synergy can do. it's right there with turntable set-up, speaker positioning etc. it's valuable to have a written, concrete example like you shared. it's also good to be surprised. 😁

Dear @mijostyn : It’s true that the SETA L20 MK2 is an excellent phono stage but as nothing in audio is not perfect.

The unit I have in my system outperform it in some specs as the RIAA eq. measurements and the noise level of my unit is almost " there " as its frequency range and several other specs.

You can go to the Channel D site and its RIAA is not so accurated as should be for a unit of that caliber. Look there its " critical " performance from 50hz and down and compare against what I own:

https://get.google.com/albumarchive/104284617601331669309/album/AF1QipMFuJ0YVzL64lrK46jDWyUx7h0SGhNyKWFEifag/AF1QipOKpGytlEsRi_miCPtIm-J7b45dCmz3bGV_Yb2f?authKey=CKaK_bnM-of_9AE

Of course that specs tell you many things but can’t explain perfectly what you are listening. I can tell you that my unit performs at very high quality levels. In the other side I never had the opportunity to listen the L20 MK2 that I’m sure is ( again ) excellent but overall the phonolinepreamp I own could compete with.

R.