VPI TNT 3
My first post! After many years of coviting this turntable, I finally ran across a 1993 TNT Series 3 for sale in my area, and for a decent price! Apparently in excellent condition. After asking all of the relevent questions, I snatched it up like no tomorrow! It came without tonearm or cartridge, but I figured out that the arm board holes were of the correct dimension and spacing to fit what I had to install: Sumiko Premier FT-3K tonearm and a Sumiko Blue Point Special cartridge. Well the K in the FT-3 meant that the hole required some mods to allow the Kenetic VTA adjustment structures! So once that was all worked out and a new large 1/4” thick aluminum platform was fabricated to sit atop my solid steel gear rack floating on 4 VPI Sorbathane legs (great for isolation). Then all of the standard alignments were thoroughly made…
Finally, I was ready to experience what this table had to offer! And OMG, I was not disappointed, even coming from a VPI HW-19 Mk III (same arm/cart pair), I was astounded at how much more there was in my record collection that I could not hear before! WOW!
I’m sure you are all aware of the virtues of the TNT, the bass reaches all new lows, and with such power and grace! There was so much more space and dimension, everything seemed so much more well defined. I had trouble getting through any one album, I wanted to listen to the next one that I had lined up for testing and sheer enjoyment!!! LOL
But my real reason for posting here was to get some feedback on how to get a replacement of the Pulley Drive System? I understand that the original owner had it purposely removed (and was not included in the packaging, except for a few of the remnants… short belt, double pulley head, mounting hardware, etc). Does anyone on here know where to get a replacement pulley drive system?
After a few more days to absorb the sonic benefits of the TNT 3, I will provide a detailed update on what I have experienced.
Thank you for your quick replies! I have reached out to VPI, but they are quite hard to get ahold of, however I did chat with a very friendly lady there who took down my information and was going to get the right person call me back today! I will keep you posted on how that goes! Not sure if they will still have parts for a 30 year old table? |
The VPI TNT 3 is a great table - I've been enjoying mine since I bought it new around '95. Many users ditched the tri-pulley system, leaving holes in the plinth for which VPI sold plugs to fill. I've kept the tri-pulleys, but you can get great sound from it either way. The table will benefit from an improved drive system such as the SDS. The original feet can definitely be improved - I replaced mine with the large feet from Mnpctech. The TNT's heavy platter is known for wearing down the platter bearing. You might want to inspect yours for wear - replacements are easy to get. |
Again, thank you for all of the great responses! I will look for that FB page! Thank you. Yes, my TNT 3 does have spring coils inside of the corner towers! I have re-purposed a set of Sorbothane legs left over from a HW-19 Jr upgrade to a Mk III. I have used them to hold up an aluminum platform to sit the large TNT form-factor on. Should provide great isolation! - replacement pulley system or plugs? - replacement for my PLC, as it does not slow the motor down enough to play 45 rpm's. - replacement bearing. - upgraded feet - upgraded clamp
Thanks for everyone’s great feedback. |
That will cost nothing to try but it's not likely to be ideal. IME, the TNT likes a solid platform, such as the rack VPI originally made for it. Its own suspension should be all it needs for effective isolation, although you can improve upon the original "elephant's feet." |
Agree with cleeds. It is never a good idea to place an internally suspended turntable on a suspended platform. The two systems are likely to interact badly, even causing oscillations that make things worse. If you are unhappy with the TNT footer suspension, you could perhaps inactivate it and then using the sprung platform might work, if all else is suitable. |
Well, you certainly raised a good point about the Sorbothane (double sprung isolation), I switched the Sorbothane legs over to standard solid tip-toe mini cones… and I can tell immediately that the bass was deeper (maybe stronger and more focused would be better adjectives), yet smoother (which was the biggest surprise), the mids and treble were clearer, less harsh (albeit only by a small margin). So good call you guys!!! Thank you. |
Congratulations. I have been using mine since 1997. I drove it to VPI in NJ twice for modifications. First was the JM 12.5 tone arm. Then second time was for the upgraded bearing and platter. During the latter mod VPI removed the 3 point spindle assembly and capped the holes. They polished the plinth. Looks new. VPI stated there is better performance without the spindle. Less noise. I concur with my own experience. Experiment with and without the 3 point spinal and let your own ears judge. New bearing and platter elevated SQ substantially. I use a Benz Ruby rebuilt a few times by SoundSmith. Good luck! |
@bhenry91: Congratulations! I’ve considered getting a TNT to replace either my HW-19 Mk.3 or my Aries, but it’s just so damn big!
Which platter does your TNT have? It (and the first iteration of the Aries) came with one comprised of the following:
1- 1.25" inches thick 2- A bottom section of 7/8" thick aluminum with a thin sheet of lead glued to it’s underside, covered with a layer of cork. 3- A top section of 3/8" thick black Delrin.
I ask because VPI later introduced a solid frosted white acrylic platter, which many TNT owners bought and used in place of the stock platter. Harry Weisfeld eventually admitted that was a misstep, as the acrylic produced a sound inferior to that of the Aluminum/Delrin platter.
On the other hand, the TNT Mk.V featured a new platter, one many VPI enthusiasts consider the best VPI platter of them all. It is comprised of:
1- 1.5" thick 2- A bottom section of 5/8" thick stainless steel. 3- A top section of 7/8" thick black Delrin.
The TNT Mk.V platters are now considered very desirable (it can be used on TNT’s Mk.1 though Mk.V, all HW-19’s, and all Aries that don’t have an inverted bearing), and sell quickly when coming up for sale, at prices $500 and up.
By the way, another option for isolating the TNT are a set of four Townshend Audio Seismic Pods, an outstanding product. . |
The platter/bearing that VPI used is a 2” all stainless steel platter. The upgrade was done about 5 years ago. It looks similar to the platter of current models. I do not think it is the same as current platters though. The arm base was changed to accommodate the platter height. Photos are in my profile. The platter/bearing combo together with removing the 3 spindle assembly lowered background noise, improved detail, staging, and imaging. I recommend you call VPI. |
Again, thank you for all of your replies, great community for sharing ideas. Appreciated! The platter that I have on my TNT3 is 1.5” thick, with the bottom 1” appears to be aluminum with 7 grooves around its perimeter, the top 1/2” appears to be black acrylic, the bottom has a sheet of cork covering the outer half of the platter with a lead-filled disk inside. It weighed in at 20lbs. |
Quick question, right at the moment, I’m using my old PLC box (that came with my HW-19) to adjust the speed control to get 33.3RPMs tested with a stroboscope printed disk. To get 33.3 I need to turn the adjustment dial down to about 9:00. However, for 45, I can’t turn the dial low enough to bring the speed down to match 45 on the stroboscope disk! Even at the lowest setting, it’s still about 2-3% fast. Does anyone have any suggestions to dial in 45rpms in the meantime until I’m able to pickup an out of production SDS or an updated PLC (currently VPI calls it the ADS). |
A 30 Year Old TT, with a Substantial weight for the Platter will have a bearing incorporated that I would be very interested to learn how it has been impacted on over time. Loss off or Deteriorated Lubricant, can be the cause of excessive metal on metal contact during rotations, causing a change to the Trueness of the Spindles Axis., Additional to this, there is Eccentric Rotations, Thrust Pad Wear, Ball Flattening or Scribing of the surface. Fortunately all able to be remediated. As per the later Platters, Acetal mechanically fastened to Stainless Steel has been well documented for the very positive impression it has on the end sound. This is a modification carried out on other Platters belonging to other TT’s. The magic seemingly Pops when the two materials are mechanically coupled together. VAS NY Inc has plenty of knowledge for the VPI TT's. I believe the VAS NY Inc and VPI Premises are very local to each other, possibly neighbours. |
"Does anyone have any suggestions to dial in 45rpms in the meantime until I’m able to pickup an out of production SDS or an updated PLC (currently VPI calls it the ADS)." This is the better option: Eclipse Series – Sota Turntables More accurate than SDS/ADS. Real time speed correction |
When I moved on from Idler Drive TT’s to onto the use of TT’s being the DD TT design, After a short time in to the DD TT’s usage, it become apparent that I was in possession of a Complete TT with extremely accurate Speed Control for less monies that the cost required to own Off Board Speed Controllers for the owned ID TT’s. The same is also witnessed for the Off Board Speed Controllers made available for BD TT’s, their expense to purchase is quite something, and a very decent DD TT, with accurate built in Speed Control can be acquired for not too different monies. In terms of using Vinyl as the Source, the market for BD TT’s as the tool to replay a Vinyl LP is quite a large market, without investigation, it would be easy to assume the BD TT has the largest proportion of TT sales. The BD TT market has running parallel, a market for devices being sold to make available improved speed control, that come come with such heft as a asking price. This to me, when such asking prices are seen for the additional devices is saddening. Having to meet such extra outlays for an improved speed control does not rest well, as BD TT's are modern as a design, surely the manufactures are able to offer the best practice speed control with supplied TT's Low turnover of sales with a High Mark Up does seem to be the sales model for add on Speed Controllers. |
Nothing that I have heard so far counts as effective isolation. Mass does not isolate a turntable from environmental noise. It does isolate the table from mechanical mishaps like skipping due to bumping into the table or using a heavy hand. The table is harder to move. Effective isolation is an isolation platform like the Vibraplane or the MinusK. Clearaudio use to sell it's magnetic bearing assemblies in graded lengths for different thickness platters. I wonder if that one could be adopted to your table. It is way better than any VPI bearing. You might consider a full Eclipse drive system from Sota, also way better than any VPI drive. Get a reflex clamp like the one Sota makes. Your tonearm is made by Jelco, not a bad thing. Your cartridge sports a 3 X 7 elliptical stylus and it tracks at 2 grams. This will lead to accelerated record wear as the contact patch is so small. Track forces that high require a line contact stylus. In that arm I would highly suggest a Soundsmith Aide. If finances won't allow it I can personally vouch for a Shure V15 V MR with a Jico SASB stylus. For about $500 you can not do better. You would have to get a super light headshell for it. |
