I appreciate dealer arrogance. What right do I have to be there? Poseur! Scum! Throw me out! Spit on me! I deserve it!
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Every audiophile who's been at it long enough has war stories to tell. Here's one of mine: In the late 70's or early 80's, I happened to wander into a local high-end audio shop. It was a gorgeous sunny day in the middle of the week. I had the day off and a couple hours to kill. So, I decided to amuse myself by investiageting what this shop had to offer. It was the middle of a workday and foot traffic was slow. I and, I assumed, the owner were the only people in the shop. Since I was only kicking tires with no intention to buy anything, I certainly didn't want to bother the owner. He seemed busy doing something and I was content to just have a quick look at the inventory and listen to the background music. After 5 or 10 minutes or so, the owner approached and asked if there was anything specific I was looking for. I explained that I had just dropped in to have a quick look around and had no intention of buying anything. Since he, evidently, had nothing better to do himself, we had a very pleasant chat about various pieces of equipment, music we enjoyed and all the stuff audiophiles would talk about in such circumstances. Just as I was about to leave and thank him for letting me look around, he asked if I had another couple minutes or so to listen, for fun, to what he said was the best two channel system in the shop. What audiophile would say "no" to that? I don't remember the specific components involved but the turntable was the best B&O had to offer in those days. The speakers were a pair of 5 or 6 foot tall electrostatic or ribbon speakers and I'm sure the amplification was the best in the shop. I remember the speakers, alone, cost more than I made in a year back then. We listened to some very nice music for about 5 minutes or so and, then, I thanked him for his time and explained I really should be on my way. The owner asked what I thought of the speakers. I responded by politely saying: "Nice." It was clear, from his somewhat surprised countenance, he expected a much more effusive or enthusiastic review. What I really had been privately thinking was: "Who the heck would pay that kind of money for these things? I've heard much better at less than half the cost!" However, realizing fidelity was in the ears of the beholder and wanting to be polite, I just said: "Nice". I tend to be honest that way. It's a curse! This launched a brief discussion about frequency response, bass articulation, detail and everything else one could imagine. You know... audiophilesplaining. This guy was so... well, "angry" wouldn't be fair but acrimoniously disappointed, verging on angry, would be about right. |
Along with several replies, yes. The audiophile community and dealers are interesting at many levels. Arrogance, elitist, opinionated... Notwithstanding this audiogon forum at times. The brick and mortar store I've used locally is great while you're a customer but once you've made your purchases, they have no time for you. I get it to a degree. But I've spent a lot of money and referred friends who have also spent considerable money and they’re of the same opinion. Once you made your purchases, you are yesterday's news. |
Maybe I have just been lucky, but all of my audio purchases over the years, at several good independent retailers, have been positive experiences. And upon my return to the store(s), weather or not I am intending to buy anything, they have always been very pleasant. Over the past several years I have been purchasing numerous products at Upscale Audio, here in Southern California. What a pleasant and professional group of people there. From the owner to the sales staff to the technical/service staff, just a great group of people. I am happy to make such a good report on an audio retailer. I hope that you all have such good fortune. But if not, don't let a bad apple spoil the barrel of quality audio retailers. Just move on to another one. The vast majority are truly great people. |
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I’ve had the experience at a certain store here and have declined to give that store my business, their loss. I find it interesting, here at least locally, you can have all the money in the world, but walk in wearing sweatpants, a Tshirt, sandals, with NY baseball cap and you will be totally ignored. Go back in a week, wearing slacks, shoes, nice shirt and they are all over you in a heartbeat. Due to my taste in fashion a few places and sales people have lost a very good cash sale. |
Yes to some degree - it is paramount to work with a dealer that you trust and vibe with. Now for a little story. When as was around 12yo or so I was starting to get into music an had a very modest system in my bedroom. Basically a Zenith Mini Wedge with Zenith Allegro speakers One day i was out shopping with mom and she wanted to go to this cosmetics shop . Having no interest i walked down the a stereo shop at the end of the plaza. They welcomed me and showed me around and let me listen to a system consisting of Mark Levinson electronics, Thonres turntable, and Magnepan speakers. Wow. I knew this hobby was for me. I then listened to a system with Threshold amps and Tandberg electronics. The thing is they took time with this "kid" who clearly had no cash and introdcued me to the hobby. Within a few weeks the parents bought me a system for my bedroom from this delaer and I remianed a customer thru my teenage years buying a variety of gear during that time. Then in collage, we had a delaer in down that sold Wilson, YBA and other hard to find gear but the systems I fell in love with were a full stack Cello system and one based around Martin Logan Quest speakers. I was a customer for years till he decided to to get out of the business. Once I find a dealer I try to stay loyal to them for the long hall and it has worked out for me for the most part.
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If you live near Milwaukee, WI - the stereo store "Audio Emporium" is a very nice middle to high end store. Dave Holmes is the owner. Extremely laid back store "vibe" with no pressure. Very friendly staff. Dave will likely be the one to assist you. Can spend as much time as u wish without any pressure to buy. I think bib overalls vs a tuxedo would be treated the same. |
@dekay Bingo! It's my gimp mask. Or, perhaps it's my T shirt that says, "I have a first world problem and you're gonna solve it for me." |
This thread highlights the importance of first impressions. The very dealer that one person a few posts back speaks glowingly of was horrible on the phone and would be the last place I would spend my money. My interaction was with the owner of the company, so I have to think they set the tone for the business. Perhaps I should give them another chance, but there are too many good dealers here in the Northwest to take the chance of subjecting myself to that again. |
@dvddesigner about 12 years back we would travel to Houston, Texas to see my in-laws. We would stay out by the galleria mall and there was a MODIA electronics store there. There was a guy named Mike who I would go see and for 3 years I would go in and look and listen and in the 4th year I bought a classe amplifier and a cp800. I knew he thought I was always kicking tires but he was patient nice and always took his time. Great guy and experience. But it reminded me why I bought from him. He earned it. I felt like I took up his time and he earned my trust and that sale. Unfortunately, I have had to deal with folks too in the past who I thought were cool but weren’t. Very unfortunate but that’s how it is. If you educate yourself in this game some folks don’t like it but it is what it is. |
@dvddesigner about 12 years back we would travel to Houston, Texas to see my in-laws. We would stay out by the galleria mall and there was a MODIA electronics store there. There was a guy named Mike who I would go see and for 3 years I would go in and look and listen and in the 4th year I bought a classe amplifier and a cp800. I knew he thought I was always kicking tires but he was patient nice and always took his time. Great guy and experience. But it reminded me why I bought from him. He earned it. I felt like I took up his time and he earned my trust and that sale. Unfortunately, I have had to deal with folks too in the past who I thought were cool but weren’t. Very unfortunate but that’s how it is. If you educate yourself in this game some folks don’t like it but it is what it is. |
Before I started Verdant (and this was part of the reason I did), I made the rounds to multiple dealers in NYC. One I really liked but there wasn't a match in terms of products. The others....when I asked "why does every track I select on this system sound terrible and the ones you pick sound great?" Response, "That's because your music sucks." Evidently it is too much to ask that I can listen to something more than Diana Krall and Nils Lofgren. Another called me and after I told him I was just about to sit down for dinner (it was 6:15) did his best to keep me on the phone for 20 minutes explaining his philosophy on sound. A third dealer has a speaker priced $1000 over MAP. When I asked why it was so much more expensive than what we reported in TAS he lied and told me they took a price increase. But, he did offer me "marketing credits" he could use to get me back to MAP.
I new I was getting screwed at the time and bought those speakers from another dealer. Now, I am now a dealer for that brand and am keenly aware of how severely he was trying to screw me. Incidentally, fairness and respect are part of my business model. |
That’s terrific. In the country where I live this is quite normal, being a largely egalitarian country. Conspicuous displays of wealth are actually viewed with some caution, as are those who are blessed with substantial wealth and are just too lazy (??) to bother to even have a sleep and a shower after maybe working straight for 50 hours (the neurosurgeon story). If they are trying to make some sort of Pretty Woman statement (for whatever deep psychological character flaw reason) then by all means go on social media and vent, should this be cathartic. On the other hand, people of modest/middle class means generally have the self respect and common sense to at least make some effort into presenting themselves in a decent manner. The salespeople may be there to serve the customer of course, but it is a two way street - you are a guest on their premises. From all the anecdotes I have read here and on another similar thread about a month ago it would appear that America is one of the least egalitarian and most judgmental places on earth and one that I probably would not enjoy visiting.
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This is more reflective of our hobby and not the vast majority of Americans. The same sort of thing happens with Whisky. Don't walk into certain bars and ask for ice or water in a single malt scotch without being insulted by the bartender and half the patrons.
Whenever money and expertise can have an influence on something, expect those "that know" to talk down to those who don't. |
I am sure that most all of us has this type of story or situation that has happened to us over the course of time. I guess rather than waste time and energy on those negative things, I’d much rather give the shout out to those that have given great service and their time! Mine, like several other stories mentioned in here, the young kid with little to not much money to spend on hifi, yet eager to listen and learn, was helped by a guy that I still respect to this day. In the early 80’s I walked in to Glen Poor’s A/V at the Round Barn center in Champaign, Illinois. I was about 22 at the time. Geoffrey Poor met me at the door, took me right back to listen to some Mark Levinson gear with Magnepan Tympani’s. He took the time to set up and listen to Tandberg, Amber, and some other gear, even though he knew I didn’t have the means at the time to purchase, and maybe never would. Yet the seed was sewn, and another visit later, I bought a pair of Pyramid Metronome 7 speakers, and eventually Magnepan MGI’s. A few more things were purchased over the course of time. I do not get over to his shop very often, maybe once or twice a year, as I moved away from the area, but when I do go in and Geoff is there, he always treats me the same way as that day back in the 80’s. I try to send others that I know to visit him, as they are able. Just a great dealer, and more so, a friend without the crap and snobbery. His dealership has moved some time ago, but doing good business to this day. It is easy to bust dealers balls, maybe some deserve it, maybe some don’t. But let’s give credit to those that do a fine job in this tough business time! FWIW…. |
Seems like every "mean dealer" thread (in any field, just not audio) has a smelly customer in bib overalls buying $200,000 story. Most dealers today, at least the ones I have encountered, are super friendly. Most do some sort of Home Theatre business as well. Selling $600 Yamaha A/V receivers, soundbars,...you name it. I'm sure there are exceptions.....my experience has been the opposite. The only issues I see is lack of display model on something newer, except McIntosh. Mac dealers generally have the newer stuff pretty quick. |
I've never had any problems with e-commerce. I have purchased McIntosh and Klipsch from Crutchfield and Music Direct and amps from Carydirect. Each kindly answered all my questions and offered suggestions. I also received thank you notes for my purchases. My experience with bricks and mortar (BM) dealers has been nowhere as satisfying. They will go unnamed here, but these jerks won't return phone calls or respond to email. I wanted to buy a Mac MC275 amp and the POCs finally got back to me after I contacted McIntosh directly. By then, I went ahead and purchased a comparable Cary tube amp and have been satisfied. The BM make their money in home theater installs not sales. Manufacturers know this, so they should consider e-commerce or direct sales. The bricks and mortar dealers should just get out of the retail business altogether and focus on their precious installations.
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