'sup? In a comparison to an impartial audience between my analog rig and my Oppo 105D > LFD LE IV rig, the consensus was the the digital end was too bright and brittle. Some more details:
Digital: Oppo 105 > Belden 840 cables > LFD LE IV > Decware Styx speaker cables
Analog: VPI HW19 MK 4/Hana ML > Morrow PH4 > LFD LE phono > AZ ICs > LFD LE IV All feeding into Spatial M3 Turbo S's I agree with the consensus. Any suggestions for a warmer digital sound? s
Try a Vibrapod 3 under each foot. I was never a fan of tweaks, but this really made my Oppo205 sound much more tonally rich. Worth trying before going down the more expensive paths I think.
A more fruitful approach would be to use an external DAC, and personally I would recommend on the does not use an ESS Sabre chip, as does the Oppo. My Oppo 105 sounds much better as a transport into my Bryston DAC3, which uses AKM manufactured chip. ESS have fantastic detail retrieval but can sound harsh. I had another DAC featuring the same chip as the 105, a Mytek Manhattan, and it offered different filter options, but none of them seemed to tame that fierce treble (my speakers are B&W 803D, and those diamond tweeters can be to much of a good thing, particularly with solo Piano). At any rate, DACs sound different, similar to variations in turntables and phono preamps. Try something else.
An external DAC using the AKM AK4490-series DAC chip might provide the sound you’re looking for. The Schiit Modi 3 at $99 is a bargain but bested by the new Modius at $199. 15-day money-back guarantee if not satisfied.
Another option is the use of an equalizer for the digital side. The 4-band Schiit Loki at $149 might be a good low-cost solution. Same guarantee.
If you feel in a spendy mood, the RME ADI-2 DAC ($1149) with AKM DAC chip and Bass,Treble, Loudness and 5-band equalizer controls might be the ultimate solution.
As I discovered, it doesn't take much these days to get a DAC that will outperform the DAC section of the Oppo 105. So I agree with the others that an external DAC may get you what you are looking for. But I disagree on the suggestion that the fault lies with the ESS chip. Some of the best DACs out there use ESS chips. And extensive modifications of the Oppo DAC section using the same chip have done very well. The secret is in the implementation. You have a very good analog set up. The Oppo is like a Swiss knife. It does a lot of things pretty well, but can be bettered for particulars.
So I'll be honest, I rarely use the Oppo for CDs anymore. Since I have lostless Tidal, I mainly use it to stream tracks from that service, tho I still play a CD every now and then. If I were to maybe sell my Oppo and invest in just something to stream Tidal (or another streaming service), what might you recommend?
The knock on the 105 (I have one) was the power supply. I found Linear Power Supplies on Ebaye. One company provides easy to follow photos. Also replace the OEM IEC . I bought the Furutech with pure silver tail that snaps on the old or new board and a jumper to bypass the 110/220 switch
Not sure I’d spend a lot on a 105D such as power supply or the IEC socket but no doubt it will help. I’d recommend using your Oppo as a transport and get a DAC. I have an Oppo 205 and it’s not up to my Cambridge 851C which I was using the DAC in it for my Bluesound Vault 2. I ended up getting a RME ADI 2fs DAC and it is better yet, much better and before I upgraded the power supply on the RME.
If you’re using your Oppo for two channel only you can probably get enough out of it to pick up better dedicated CD player only like a used Cambridge 851C, or upper used Marantz models. If budget allows keep your Oppo and pick up a DAC.
It will make a good transport. Depending on your budget, the Schiit Dacs have a good rep as does the Denafrips Ares II at around $700. Your coax cable makes a difference. The mellowest coax digital cable I've found is the Audio Advisor Penangea for $95. Belden's standard coax at $20 is also a good cable. I've tried the expensive cables and you can expect more detail but attendant brightness and more of what you don't like. Also Have you done the latest Firmware update on your Oppo. They still have a legacy web site and can upgrade your unit They sent me a DVD to upgrade my Oppo 93 software.
I have several CD players but I use my Oppo 105D more than the others mainly for the features available via the remote, like volume. Also, it has a solid, competent sound. I bought a Benchmark DAC1 many years ago, but never got around to using it until I bought a pair of Audeze LCD-X, closed back phones. When I hooked up the DAC to my Oppo, I was shocked at how much it improved the sound. I shouldn’t be surprised as the Oppo cost around $1400, and handles nearly every type of disc, while the Benchmark cost $999 and simply converts the digital signal, but does it very well. Forget that crude comparison and just believe me that a good DAC (like Benchmark) will tame that bright sound of your Oppo.
What was the cost of your digital versus your vinyl setup? Not really a fair comparison now, is it? Sheesh. If you’re at all serious about getting better digital sound, invest in a better separate streamer and DAC. If it was me, and since you do more streaming than disk spinning these days anyway, I’d ditch the transport altogether and get an Innuos Zen Mk.3 streamer/server and just load all my CDs into it. Then I’d get something like an MHDT Orchid or Audio Mirror Tubadour SE DAC and another set of AZ interconnects to link it to your LFD and then do another comparison. Just upgrading to a better DAC should help quite a bit.
I totally agree it all starts with the PS, and don’t at all question the IEC socket didn’t help things but I think I’d still look at a DAC instead of putting the money into an Oppo first. That being said it still might makes sense to upgrade the Oppo as a transport only if one chooses another DAC. I’ve modified equipment myself and always achieved better sound but I don’t think a power supply alone will make an Oppo sound like say a RME DAC or others, but maybe it will. I’ve not heard a modified ModWright/Oppo player but owning a ModWright preamp I have no doubt Dan doesn’t transform the Oppo’s but at a much steeper price. I’ve thought about changing out the PS in my UDP-205, so maybe I’ll try it and report back... If for anything I can change out the fuse then.
@jafant That's a good description of the Oppo's sound. Just a bit too bright and smooth. As @soix points out, I've invested much, much more in my analog rig than in my digital end.
Just look at the dac section in your manual or in reviews to see that while it can be beaten, it will take some $$$ to do so
Anyway, even if you choose to use it as a transport only, you will STILL want to upgrade the PS, etc. My suggestions do that before spending $3K+ on a dac that might not be any better anyway. But hey, YMMV
I use Cardas Neutral Reference cables and 3 Isoacoustics Indigo footers under the chassis. Sounds good. You can use the Bronze footers which match the weight better. These were not out yet when I bought the Indigos and are a little bit cheaper. Of course a better DAC would be good, but try the footers first.
I am just at opposite ends from @tweak1 — while beating the DAC in the Oppo may have been more challenging a few years back, with the explosion of excellent DACs in the $700 - $1500 range I think you could now find a relatively inexpensive DAC that bests the Oppo handily for your tastes fairly easily. And since you don’t spin discs much these days (like me) and Oppo is out of business and your 105 could fail (mine did), why would you buy a power supply for it and add further to the potential loss? Again, I’d start by just trying a new DAC and see what you think — many offer in-home trials these days that makes it very easy to do. Then upgrade your streamer as funds allow as that matters a great deal too, and if you get one with an onboard disc drive and storage like the Innuos I mentioned above you’ll never have to get off your arse to spin another disc ever again and have all your music at your fingertips. And without a doubt I’d replace those Belden interconnects with a used pair of AZ Silver Refs (I have and love them) or the like — relatively cheap and significant upgrade. FWIW, and best of luck in upgrading your digital front end — you’ll really appreciate and enjoy the music so much more.
Simao if you listen to vynil a lot, yours ears will get use to it, then you go back to digital the tendency your oppo will sound a bit bright, It takes a week or two to reset your ears.
I get the impression that some feel that an external DAC is automatically better than a the one in a self contained player. While this might be true in some circumstances, I don't think it necessarily so in all circumstances. There can be some technical reasons that a separate DAC, such as perhaps having it's own power supply and distancing from internal motors, etc.. might have some advantages. On the other hand, some all in ones might have separate internal power supplies, and isolation measures built in. Unless the separate DAC has I2S input from a so equipped transport, there will be necessary conversion of outputs and inputs, which is just one area where jitter could be introduced by separating the stages. There seems to be way more available separate DACs than separate transports, which suggests to me that one is more profitable than the other. To buy an all in one player to bypass the internal DAC seems to me to be rather cost inefficient, and while possibly though not necessarily better.
Thank you all for your comments. To recap: 1. The Oppo’s DAC is its weakness and I should look for an external DAC 2. The Oppo’s DAC is quite good and can’t be bested unless I want to spend more money then it’s worth. 3. The Oppo itself is a gem of a component.
4. The Oppo itself is overrated and can easily be overshadowed by more contemporary components.
5. Replacing the power supply is the way to go.
6. Replacing the power supply is not the way to go.
Luckily no one so far has suggested room treatments.
Try feeding an external usb drive directly into the Oppo playing .wav files. That is how it sounds best in my system; beats spinning a disc and .flac format. Never found the 105 to be bright under that configuration. If anything, there’s a slight (artificial?) smoothness and maybe a slight pronouncement in the lower frequencies, but not bright.
I agree with some of the other posts that suggest the OPPO's use of the ESS DAC chip is potentially the primary reason your impartial listeners found the sound a little harsh. This is not contradictory to the fact the OPPO analog output is very good or that the player is an excellent product and outstanding value. Many people like the strengths of the OPPO analog output and of the ESS DAC chips.
But if someone feels there is some harshness or listening fatigue which outweighs the other parts of the ESS-based DAC sound, then a very common alternative are the AKM 449X-based DACs because just like the ESS the AKM chips are used a lot. These also produce very good sound but along with potentially sounding less harsh or fatiguing there are other aspects that will sound different.
Obviously this is a generalization of implementations of the ESS and AKM chipsets, and there are some products where this characterization doesn't strictly apply, but on balance I feel this is a reasonable starting assumption without additional information about the DAC design or without having heard the DAC itself.
Thank you all for your comments. To recap: 1. The Oppo’s DAC is its weakness and I should look for an external DAC 2. The Oppo’s DAC is quite good and can’t be bested unless I want to spend more money then it’s worth.
Fortunately this can be tested. You can demo DACs like the Audio Mirror Tubadour Mklll SE or MHDT Orchid, etc. at home as they offer trial periods. I’d think it’d be well worth your while to take advantage of this, and I’d be very surprised if you didn’t hear significant improvements. FWIW.
Buy a dedicated cd player....the oppo is a do everything wonder, but not designed as a dedicated cd player and therefore is a compromise to fit all that in one box. It’s a great product, I own the 205. Better yet, get a cd transport and the dac of your choice. I’m using both a Marantz space saving cd hd1, as well as the audiolab cdt6000. For dacs, I use the musical fidelity v90 dac and a jolida glass dac, both top rated dacs in their respective price ranges. Another great dac would be a border patrol. But to be honest, when I really sit down and listen, I'm listening to LP's, analog.
I must agree , my Oppo 105D is too bright . I also tried using my Audeze headphones and what I disliked about my Oppo was highlighted. I currently run a Schiit Yiggy and a Musical Fidelity transport . Most my interconnects are Morrow . I too considered upgrading the Oppo, but at this late date , I didn’t . I’m running a Rogue Pre and a Dennis Had Inspire to Zu Omens . Even with high quality NOS tubes, the Oppo was “ Too Edgy “. I went from a Schiit Bifrost to the Yiggy and couldn’t be happier . I can’t recommend other DACs without having auditioned one in my system, so I won’t . I use a Dennis Grey power filter , Hubbel outlets , Morrow power cords , and digital specific power cords for the DAC and transport . My TT is a modded Thorens with a Grado cartridge. So by comparison streaming Tidal Vs vinyl , it’s real close . But to be fair my TT needs a tonearm and cartridge upgrade which would definitely take it up a level . So to compare Tidal Masters streaming Supertramp’s “ Crime of the Century” to spinning my Mobil Fidelity Masters record , they both sound pretty good . The caveat of my share is that I’m on level “ B “ in Stereo land and there’s a ton of sky above me . So now my Oppo is in the closet due to limited rack space . I have a large collection of concert DVD’s and every once in a while will play one . So my vote is with the “ Get a Nice DAC “ camp, as 90% of my listening goes through the Yiggy . Happy Hunting , Mike B.
Ideas: Try playing with the OPPO filters. Use the balanced analog output if you can and turn off the gain control. Don’t use ’bright’ cables - try the inexpensive Benchmark Media cables. Get a really well-recorded SACD (Heifetz, Roger Waters, Jorma Kaukonen, or Patricia Barber) to use as reference. Use the OPPO USB input from a Mac Mini streaming buffered QoBuz music over a CAT 7 ethernet and a 300Mb internet connection. Use ’Pure Audio’ mode.
Have an Oppo 105D with the Modwright vacuum tube and external power supply option. Closest thing to high quality vinyl that I’ve heard. May be hard to find on used market though.
Update: I replaced the Belden 804 cables with Acoustic Zen Silvers and rested the Oppo on four Nobsound Silver/Aluminum spring pods.
Result: the sound is more focused, more resonant, more in-depth. Definitely not as bright as before. Streaming Dominique Fils-Aime’s "Nameless" album via Tidal lossless and it’s flawless.
Unfortunately, I can't use the balanced outputs anymore now that I'm using the LFD. That was a trade-of for its superior presence over my previous Pathos Classic Mk3
Glad you are getting better results. I mentioned to you about Vibrapods making a big difference with the Oppo and you seem to be experiencing a similar improvement with the pods you tried. I would still try the Vibrapods if you have some lying around. Amazing how changing the footers on some components can make such a difference and sometimes nothing. Same with cables.
I rarely use my OPPO which is in a back up system with a TV. It did not sound that great with CD’s so I mainly streamed from a pro iDSD. I had an extra RCA High Fidelity cable from my main system so I decided to use it on the OPPO yesterday. Made a significant improvement and CD’s with the OPPO now sounding better (not bright at all) than streaming QoBuz & Tidal with the pro iDSD. I use these same cables on the pro iDSD & use a High Fidelity MC-6 hemisphere power conditioner in that system.
So here's another question: I'm in negotiations for a Lyngdorf 2170. How does that deck inside compare with the Oppo? Should I run a coaxial cable from the Oppo to the link dwarf and essentially use the Oppo as a transport?
I got a good deal on a Silnote reference coaxial, which arrived yesterday and which I subsequently hooked up between the 2170 and the Oppo. It definitely improves the balance, but only when I ran the 2170 in bypass mode; that is, bypassing the room correction.
If you want the same functionality in digital music playback, swap the OPPO for a Cambridge Audio 752BD or CXU.Same basic transport but with upsampling DAC. Sweeter, smoother, more musical playback. I have both units, OPPO for home theater, Cambridge for music. :)
If I am not mistaken, Vitus uses ESS chips in their RI-101 and SIA-030 integrated amp DACs. Furthest from bright you can get. Goes to show it’s all about the implementation.
I have had an OPPO 105 for a few years and it is quite good. I never considered it harsh, but maybe compared to a good Vinyl rig it might seems too clinical.
I do have a vinyl rig but it is modest compared to most people here.
You can do some cheap tweaks on the OPPO 105 in addition to the cable swapping.The IEC connector replacement is cheap and easy.(I looked at power supply replacement but was dissuaded by those more knowledgeable than me). You can dampen your CD transport with Dynamat or similar.Make sure you are using good power cords on all of your gear. I am sure you are. Also Hubbel HBL5262I outlets are cheap off of Ebay.All made a subtle difference for me in terms of noise floor and SQ. I use a VAC Standard LE preamp and do some tube swapping. Mostly I look for dead quiet NOS tubes.
One of my big ongoing projects is to reduce noise at every level. LOL. System is dead quiet background.
I mostly stream via Jriver these days from my PC hard drive over home network.
I ended up getting a used OPPO Sonica Dac that also uses an ESS chip (newer version). It has built in network ability like the OPPO 105 so I can stream DSD and anything else. I stream a lot of DSD/hi rez Flac as well as garden variety Mp3s. Nice step up for not a lot of money. Does everything a little better. I only use the OPPO for CDs and can send the signal to the external Sonica if I want.
It's all good. Like all of us I am always thinking about upgrades so who knows down the road.
Honestly - stating the obvious the best source material is a key to the best sound.
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