The psychological factor

It sounds like your new amp has a different input sensitivity than your old amp.  Then again, it could be something else.  Without the name and model of the components I'm just guessing.

Preamps should sound better in the upper range on the volume control!

Amp is a Benchmark AHB2.  Interestingly it has three “sensitivity” switch settings which control volume levels.  I have it on the lowest setting.

Preamp is Conrad-Johnson PV11 modded with teflon caps.

hesitate?

You probably should be using the mid or high setting the low setting is used to interface with pro gear on the Benchmark. Did you ask  Benchmark if your preamp would be a good match at the low setting?

Yes I did.  They said it wouldn’t be a problem.
On the mid setting, the volume.control was unmanageable, especially with the high output cartridge I’m using.

What preamp are you using?

With my Benchmark HPA4 preamp and AHB2 amp set to low gain setting (the defaults) I really need to move the volume control to the far right to get high volume, just the way I like it.

This combo also sounds great at low volume, which is unusual for me with past gear. Sometimes I listen at low volume late at night even though I have the amazing Meze Empy headphones which I can plug into the HPA4. You hear everything even at low volume, just quieter.

As indicated above, preamp is Conrad-Johnson.

Look, you turn it up as loud as you like. Who cares about the position of the volume control. If you can not get to the volume you want then you need a more powerful amp, one with a higher input sensitivity or a preamp with more output. If that does not do it throw the whole mess away and start over but be prepared to spend at least three times the money. 

The volume control on every system has a sweet spot or sweet zone where the music in your room to your ears sounds best. It can change slightly from recording to recording or even from genre to genre. The numbers on the dial are merely reference point so you can find that place again and are otherwise pretty meaningless.

rvpiano, I have AHB2 and use it at the lowest gain settings (Pro-level) as recommended by Benchmark (with DAC3 HGC). The whole idea is to move as much gain as possible to preamp (quieter environment) from power amp (noisier environment), not to mention less (percentage wise) electrical noise pickup on ICs between the two.   As for psychological factor - I like my max power to be around 2 O'Clock to be sure it will cover even very quiet records.  3 O'Clock makes me feel uneasy.

If only there were some memorable way of showing just how irrelevant the numbers on the volume control are....
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4xgx4k83zzc

I find 9 o’clock and 10 on my sugden class A is plenty loud driving my tannoys. This is for both cd and lp’s. To think it only has 30 watts into 8 ohms....I’d guess by the volume it is capable of putting out, it has a lot more, but most likely not. I Used to own a 100 watt rogue class D, and I still own a 90 watt marantz (now in storage),  and I miss neither.

I have an amp that outputs 500watts@8ohm 650@4ohms & 1,200 watts@1ohm also will do 65 amps for 500 milliseconds and If I set my ARC LS15 pre amp volume to the 10 o'clock position I can barely hear my wife scream!!

I run the amp(s) @ 10, since anything 'upstream' controls the ultimate volumn.  In that fashion, the 'noise floor' is obvious....

One does have to be careful as to what to turn on when and how, but that becomes a matter of routine....

aewarren,

I think your right that every preamp has a sweet spot below which the sound is compromised.  I think I found it.

On my Parasound A21/P5 combo, I typically listen with the volume control at 9 position, at night even less.  If I go above 11, it starts to feel uncomfortably loud.  Maybe it's my getting older -- I don't like the screaming volume level at hard rock concerts either.  Or, maybe its the limits imposed by my speakers, Martin Logan 60 XT?  Maybe they are best a laid-back volume?  Or it could be my room acoustics, or some combination of the above.

I find the time of day is synergistic with the control position.
So 8.00pm when I'm wide awake I set it at 8.00.
By 11.00pm I'm getting dozy and find 11.00 best.
But if I really get into it and listen until 3.00am then I set at 3.00 - good and loud, so I don't fall asleep.
I'm thinking of getting a motorised control that automatically moves the control slowly to the right so I don't have to keep getting up from my chair.

People with remotes don't have this trouble  Their settings are like   24, 37, 54 or 116.
Perhaps squares will sound best - 25,   49,   81  or whatever.
If that's right then cubes and fourth powers must be better or settings that are powers of more than one root, 64 would be good.

Remote users, please let us know!

My ARC  LS15 pre amp has a remote that is very convenient and I can also control the volume with my Exogal Comet plus DAC through my phone or the remote that came with the Exogal
I typically set the Exogal to 100 and let the LS 15 do the volume control. I wish my SVS Ultra 13 Sub had a remote though. For my listening, it's not the the quanity of volume, but rather the quality of the volume 

The situation will be different with resistor ladders and the like, but don't conventional pots (e.g. ALPS) have an optimal sonic operational range, which is usually about mid-way between min and max?

     I utilize the spacing, intensity and duration of my wife's incessant high amplitude screeches to "turn that friggin noise down", along with a quick subjective estimation of the quantity, size and weight of all the household objects being simultaneously thrown at my head,  as a general guideline pertaining to the proper setting of my preamp's volume control. 
     I really appreciate her altruistic devotion to the continued safe operation of my gear and hearing capacities.  Are all you guys and gals this lucky?

Bless her,
   Tim


 

i just ordered my wife ear plugs today from Amazon.
Not joking!

My wife just ordered 2 paper bags for me. What’s that all about??

Not a compliment, Roc.

One bag goes over your head: guess where the 
other one goes, and when?

I also think the concept of 'where the knob is pointing' influences my behavior too. One remedy is to just concentrate on DB. Most listening above 90 is loud! While pleasant, you probably hope for dynamic ranges within 50-90db. Depending on the music, one trick is to have a usable db that gives some excitement when it deserves it. 70 seems good, regardless of the knob, you can use an app or some other way to measure, but it will help you maintain your sanity. 

hilarious MillerCarbon.  You guy's are forgetting the cartridge output, phono stage gain setting, etc., plus if you have a remote control with the volume, of course the knob doesn't move when you raise the volume on the remote. Lastly, every record is recorded differently which sometimes changes the volume at a given setting.

Bottom line, turn it up to where you like and avoid getting hit with things by or screamed at by your wife. My wife is scared to go near the stereo, but she sure as hell knows where the volume knob is ......it's like an unwanted extra remote control.

How much current your preamp can deliver matters, as well as the sensitivity of your amp.  My Audire Diffet 3 will push three amps with not problem.  Of course,  it needs more volume to do this, but never needs anything past 12:00.  It might push 5 or six amps.  Audire's Julius Siksnius was always a huge power supply freak, as indicated by his two 500 watt trannys and 8 26,000 mf caps in his 125 wpc amp, compared to two 375 watt trannys and 4 4000 mf caps in a Bryston 200 wpc amp.  

I am with Kijanki, use the gain provided by the preamp. Likely will sound better when using  50-75% of it's gain. With digital there are many preamps that provide too much gain. Having an amp that allows a choice with it's gain is a plus.

Wouldn't it be better to have the preamp matched to the amp, so that at the amps max output the preamp volume control would be up above 12:00 taking the deficiencies of the volume control out of the equation.

My amp has no numbers or markings on its volume control and it drives me crazy trying to figure out what volume I’m on - it’s frustrating beyond belief. It Is the best sounding and most balanced amp I have ever had, but I’m so sick of using my ears, and not ultimately knowing it’s volume setting by just looking at it is killing me. So I’ve decided to replace it with an amp the volume of which I can actually see. ; )

rvpiano - entirely in good psychological humour and friendship : ) - kevin

kevn,

I sympathize with you.  When my preamp was out for repair I got one with a remote control, which I thought would be great.  But it drove me crazy not knowing what the level was.

I was kidding! 🤣

I love using my ears rather than my eyes : )

hilarious MillerCarbon. You guy’s are forgetting the cartridge output, phono stage gain setting, etc., plus if you have a remote control with the volume, of course the knob doesn’t move when you raise the volume on the remote.

Yeah, its one of the greats. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4xgx4k83zzc Sad no one else gets it. Sadder still everyone pretending like it matters. Oh well.

My preamp goes to 11. And yes, I've taken it there. 

big_greg:" My preamp goes to 11. And yes, I've taken it there."

     Nice Spinal Tap reference, big g, my preamp's volume is digital and goes to a max on each input of 80 dBs.  That tops a random "11", right? 

  “ It's such a fine line between stupid, and uh… "

Tim 

Not only is my volume control bigger (TacT 2.2X) but it has no numbers and goes on and on forever (it is optical). This means my system can blow a hole through the ozone and change the axis of the earth's magnetic field. It goes so loud my cable elevators glow in the dark and my lawn wart starts smoking. My wife is threatening divorce and the FBI has me listed as public enemy #2. Millercarbon is public enemy #1:) 

    There are early warning signs the volume's too high:

-The walls begin cracking.
-A window shatters.
-An earthquake warning is triggered.
-Your ears or eyes begin to bleed.
-You can't hear the jack hammer.
-Cops on your doorstep.
-My wife yelling and throwing things at you.

Handy hints,
Tim