My speakers are $11,000 (I paid $6300) my subs are $5000 ($2500 each).
Not sure you can look at it as a ratio as the entry into subs is expensive. For example I would be happy running JBL 590s ($900 a pair now) with my current JL subs but I could also run a pair of Wilson Sasha DAW ($40k) with my current subs and both systems would be fine and integrate well.
I think the real question is how much do you need to spend on a good sub and more importantly how is the crossover handled.
Look at something like the JTR. At $3200 it has to be pretty amazing with great price for performance but it is ugly and no one is going to wants it sitting next to their Rockports…
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Thanks for the thoughts James. Yes, you are correct that the real question I intended to ask was how much do we need to spend on a good sub, or couple of subs. The price ratio of the sub to speaker is another way of asking the question. I realized that the cost of a good sub is not exactly cheap. Once people go with two or even three subs, the total cost of the subwoofers may have exceeded the cost of the main speakers.
I’m not sure if it’s wise to spend a lot of money on subwoofers. Having said that, I suppose it may be possible that few folks here have invested more on subs than speakers, especially those who run multiple subs. I will be getting a REL so any other sub which includes the JTR does not interest me anymore.
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By the way, the MSRP of my speakers inclusive of matching stands is $9,700. The future sub will cost $2,749 each.
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@ryder I have two Rythmik F12 Direct Servo subwoofers (Signature Edition) which I think are much better value than REL subs. They're $1260 each and are amazing. I got a REL 328-R used for about $900. I use all three. The ratio of these subs together is about 1:1 with my speakers. I could probably do without the REL, but the multi-sub approach works well in my room. At some point, I will get better speakers and the ratio will change, but the subs are here to stay.
In other words, the ratio of sub cost to speaker cost is hard to judge unless one controls for value (value is the ratio of sound quality to cost). In my estimating, having three REL subs would be way too expensive, ratio-wise, for the speakers I have.
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You could look at the speaker and subs single price. Say subs and speakers are $15,000 how does that hold up against $15,000 speakers? I would guess pretty well and probably better. Most speakers with good deep bass these days are pricy.
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About 1:1 at around $11K/pair each, which includes the price of their dedicated Sound Anchor stands.
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I would rather know how well yours got set up. Did you drop it in and forget about it? Did you put in bass traps, does it come with EQ or did you use an external unit?
Also, if anyone is interested:
https://data-bass.com/
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My speakers were 4K and my sub was 1K.
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My speakers are Revel Ultima Studio 2’s, my subwoofers, are (2) Rythmik F12SE’s. They pair very well,sonically. So, I guess if you are using retail to retail….5:1.
As already mentioned, the Rythmiks are a disproportionate value. I like how they sound but someone else may not. This makes ratio measuring, meaningfully murky.
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My subs only cost around $2,000, but they are eq'ed to only operate below 27hz. I had to supply my own amps.
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I don't really think the ratio matters. You should be buying a sub for your room, not what speakers you have. I had a pair of Sf Sonetto 8s ($7000) and got a T9i ($1300). It sounded great in my small room, but in my main living room the T9i was inadequate for the room size. I upgraded to a Rel 212 ($5000) and it's more then enough to pressurize the room. When I upgraded to Kanta 2 speakers ($11000), it is still more then enough.
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I guess this thread shows why undersized mini-monitors are so popular--people want an excuse to buy a set of subs.
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My sub to main speaker ratio is almost exactly 1 : 1 and I’m using all passive speakers.
The subwoofer amp was about $1,000 more than the mains amplifier. Add in the required outboard crossover for $4500 as well.
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sub rrp £3000 paid 900. speakers rrp £4000 paid 2000.
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I paid 750$ for my Altec A7 last year.
But two Scaena 18 inch subwoofers cost much more than that.
Thomas
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Spending for 10.000 dollars speakers and than you needs a sub, there is something wrong. Than you can spend better your sub money for an amplifier.
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Actually I can do without subwoofers with my Altec A7.
But they give little bit of more oomph.
Thomas
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I have 3 older REL subs, 2 Q150Es and one Q108 MK 2, 2 were 200 bucks each and one was maybe 250...my mains are Heresy III "Capitol Records 75th Anniversary" (woopty friggin' do) editions and they cost 14 thousand bucks a pair. I may have paid too much for those, but they're real good.
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@james633
You are correct. I probably wouldn’t want them next to my Rockports. Would like to at least hear them though.
Regards
Ron
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I paid very low prices for the sub setup. If I bought it all new now it would cost double what my speakers cost. As we used to say at work, run to failure.
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2:5
Harbeth 30.2 XD with 2 REL T/9x
Running 1 sub in a stereo set up is pointless.
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At list pricing: about 1:19 At used/paid prices: 1:8.5
The Raidho D2s, when 'tamed for the room and its own bass' still reaches down to 31Hz near flat. Sealed SVS subs (3) are low passed at 40, 50, and 60 to merely add ambiance/ultra-low reinforcement with D2s run full range.
(I know I need a good crossover to high pass the D2s...eventually.)
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You can easily build a great subwoofer (sealed cabinet) for the cost of the driver + $100 or so for the wood, terminals, etc. The subwoofer boom is a great money maker for the manufacturers, the profit margin is breathtaking, but there' nothing complicated about them. Feel free to ask for details.
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My subs cost me 1250.00 between the two (used). The two speaker sets I had were 800.00 for the smaller pair and 1350.00 for the larger pair (also both used). That was my old system. No sub in my new system.
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In my secondary system, which is a five speaker AVR/TV system, my five speakers consist of three NHT Super Zero 2.1 speakers and two small wall mount Definitive Technology speakers. I have had them for quite a while. When I listen to two channel music, the NHT Super Zero's are the stereo speakers. The Super Zero's are little acoustic suspension speakers with 4.5 inch woofers, which I have mounted on the wall Those speakers now cost about $250 a pair.
My first sub woofer in this system was an inexpensive Pioneer SW-8MK2 that recently died. I replaced that with an SVS 3000 Micro, which cost $899. Once that I got the SVS 3000 Micro dialed in, the improvement in sound quality was astounding for both 2 channel listening. It was like listening to a different set up speakers. Changing the crossover to 120Hz instead of 80Hz made a big difference as did fiddling with correction settings on the SVS sub woofer.
The sub woofer cost to speaker cost ratio in this setup is extreme, but it shows how much difference a good sub woofer can make with smaller speakers. With the SVS sub woofer, 2 channel music in this modest system comes much closer to the sound of my much more expensive primary system.
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Good bass is expensive. While you can buy a modest set of new monitors today for $500 to $1,000 that don’t absolutely suck and can give you plenty of hi fi enjoyment with decent electronics ahead if them, the same cannot be said for a subwoofer. I have not heard any sub recently that retail for below a grand that I consider adequate. And if your room is large, you can at least double that. If you want to smooth out room effects you can double that again and buy at least two.
The plus side of subs in addition to providing bass extension almost no passive set of speakers, floor standers or monitors, can provide, is that you can use stand mounts and in principle get both the imaging advantages and full frequency bass. The cost is that setting up subs to fill in higher bass frequencies can be tricky.
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Harbeth 30.2 XD with 2 REL T/9x
Running 1 sub in a stereo set up is pointless.
A lot of people advocate a minimum of 2 subs but some rooms (including mine) can’t accommodate more than 1 either due to the size or arrangement. Nevertheless, there are reports that one sub can work very well, and there are few who use a single high end sub in their systems to great effect.
Instead of creating a new thread on experiences with a single subwoofer, I’ll just post this here. Have a look at the photo below which is taken from another forum. This is the top of the the line REL No. 25. The sub looks small as the speakers are huge in real life, weighing in at more than 200 pounds each.
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Speakers $60K (new - paid less that $2K)
Subs - $2500
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My sytem ratio as recently configured with 2 subs is about 3:1.
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When I had subs: 1 : 4 (each sub)
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