tgun5, what you say is largely spot-on . However the two groups are not mutually exclusive . Many of this forum are both even though it's only .0000001 of Americans .
A couple years ago I sold some cables to a woman. We spoke on the phone for hours about audio, the "madness", and music in general. I was amazed the entire time as this was the first and ONLY time I ever had an encounter with a female audiophile. I didn't know they existed.
All audiophiles are not music lovers. Not in the sense of sitting down and listening to an entire CD/Album or an entire symphony. Back in the day we would have group listening sessions that would last 4-5 hours. The true music lovers
(and beer lovers)
would show and stay. The guys that would change their system every month, not so much. So I've always said that there are audiophile music lovers and audiophile equipment lovers.
Let's see, there's Enid Lumley, May Belt, Elizabeth and Sue Kraft, the latter two which post mostly over on Audio Asylum on various sundry topics. May used to post most regularly on AA and Stereophile Forum.
How about the fact that both Stereophile and Absolute Sound now have excellent female reviewers? In addition to the dealer mentioned above in Toronto, there's also Stereotypes Audio (GREAT NAME) in Portland, OR. Yes, we are out here. I know several women audiophiles, including my sister and best friend (both Harbeth fans). I've been deep into this for about five years--I've put in dedicated lines and acoustic treatment, and have KEF, Harbeth, Silverline, Trenner & Friedl, Mr. Speakers, Vinnie Rossi, Brinkmann, Exposure, Rega, & Line Magnetic gear currently in use in one set up or another. Getting started now with vinyl and tubes. Yes, there are a lot of us! I've gotten a lot of help from this forum over the past several years. Thanks for that -Margot
Excellent post teo. After 25 years of experience with my (American) wife (boy, can she hear!) and audio, I find what you say about women’s sensitivity to upper mids and highs in the vocal range very true. Many a time she has saved me from getting stuck with aggressive-sounding gear/cables that, at first, sounded detailed/lively/exciting/etc to me but ultimately fatiquing later on (thankfully before the return period expiration).
(1) as written, a politically incorrect original post just waiting to flame up. (2) one of the largest audio dealers in Toronto is a member of the fairer sex.
I’ve sold teo GC cables to about 4 women, probably members of this forum, or at least readers who are audiogon members. The cable reveals much not before heard, but it does it with no false added exaggeration in the disputed frequency ranges--which wire will falsify and distort.. Which is why some guys find it dark, when it is not, no, not at all.
Angie (american sound) has trained many of the people who opened up their own shops, over the years..in the Toronto area. She says she trained her own competition. She’s not wrong.
Regarding women and hearing. the place they use in their hearing range to interpret the cries of children and newborns, is the range the human ear is most sensitive to, and it (the spacial and detail sensitivity) peaks at about 3-4khz.
Women do not like equipment, cables, or speakers that emphasize or distort this region of frequencies and transients.
Men use this range of frequencies to hunt through the jungle and be able to spatially locate things in 3d space, in order to protect or to hunt. Men find this to be exciting and is the detail range of frequencies, which many men look for in audio. I find this sound characteristic to be fatiguing and hard.
Men get excited (in general terms) by it and women (in the same scenario and room) run from the room clasping their ears (in general terms).
There are a few, but few others will take up something that will cut into(destroy?) their fashion , shoe and jewels budget . Not to mention the new furniture .
My ex was an audiophile although I don’t think she continued after we separated. She was one that would listen to a song 5-10 times to dial in VTA/azimuth with me and comment on the results with surprising details and accuracy. She expressed interest in learning/doing the adjustments herself and got quite good at it. Also preferred tubes over SS.
The wife of one of my audiophile friends is a raving audiophile right along with us. She is well versed in all things audio and has a huge say in what tweaks and/or new components make the grade or are rejected. She attends all the trade shows with us as did my ex and both thoroughly enjoy(ed) them.
I am loving this thread! And to Papermill..I am happy for you and enjoyed this Axpona show story of yours. I try to encourage women and thank them for coming to audio shows as often as possible. I encourage them to learn more about this fantastic hobby and also give them some education about how I record my music with the best known engineers in the audio world, Al Schmitt and Bernie Grundman and the women often like the stories behind the music I share and learning how the systems respond to music created by these wonderful engineers. Women have great "ears" and I hope more take an interest in this hobby.
Two times now I have been without a preamp and was forced to go direct via the variable output on different CDPs. Both times my wife has said it sounds like s**t. I don't know if it qualifies her but she can hear the difference.
My wife surprised me a couple weeks back. I was doing a 30-day in home audition of a new amplifier. I figured it best to keep her involved for WAF so I did a blind A/B test with her. I played selections from my standard CD Pink Floyd "Wish You Were Here," then I played the same from the newer remastered Experience Edition. I asked her which do you like better and she chose the remaster every time no matter how I changed the play order. Then I played Rush Moving pictures FLAC 44.1/16 and compared it to FLAC 96/24 and she chose the 96/24 file (I'm still not sure if the 96/24 sounded better due the oversampling or being remastered but, that is for another thread later). Anyhow there we have it, a recently discovered female audiophile.
@ redridinghood, welcome fellow female audiophile (in the making). I also learned a lot about music systems on forums (and am still learning). You are in for quite a ride, but remember, in the end your own ears will let you know what sound is right for you. Enjoy the journey!
Too soon? I literally just found this forum. I'm calling myself an audiophile-in-training - and female. I've always had the pleasure of enjoying excellent audio because my father had it set up. that was years ago - now I'm starting my on my own, looking to recreate the goodness. Hope to learn a lot from you all!
@mewsickbuff You would think so, but I've run into a few guys who can't even listen to a whole song. All they want to do is play test tracks for 30 seconds and A/B test until the cows come home. The best way to shut them up is to ask them what new albums they are enjoying lately! Cheers, Spencer
In my collection I've got some down right awful recordings, and many more that are just mediocre. But I love music and dig past all that to embrace the music. When I listen to well recorded music of course I'm in music heaven, but those who aren't pure music lovers are missing out on a LOT! Of course I grew up in the transistor radio era, too. Might have a little to do with it.
@ path2one, I hear you. @ sbank, thanks. @ slaw, just a thought, I would think not all music lovers are audiophiles, but aren't all audiophiles music lovers?
Although I never followed from the beginning, I assumed "Elizabeth" was a male. audiowoman:, You should have nothing to prove, IMO. It just helps to post on ongoing listening thoughts now & then. To be a music lover is more important than being an "audiophile".
willgolf, you’re just going to have to get your wife to understand the necessity of a listening room in your new house. That will be yours and she can have the great room all to herself. It's cheaper than a divorce.
audiowoman, Nice to see you post here. You may want to look into MQA (a new way of encoding digital music that is supposed to sound better, if you haven't heard) before buying a server. If MQA is for real, you may want a streamer, a Tidal subscription and an MQA decoding DAC. I don't know how long it may take to determine if MQA is for real though.
I know my spouse is not one. I recently bought a pair of Wilson Audio Duette 2's with a Raven integrated MK2 Reflection tube amp. I am building a new house and was going to put the speakers in the great room. All I have heard for the last three months is her bitching how those speakers are going to wreck the room. She can't understand why in wall speakers aren't acceptable. She has made it a point to make my life miserable over these speakers so I think I am going to sell them without ever hearing them. It is cheaper than getting a new wife.
Ah, how sad to be so forgotten. I actually haven't posted much in the last year or so because I'm quite happy with my Avalon Ideas, Ayre 7xe integrated amp, squeezebox Touch, Wyred 4Sound dac2 and my pretty Cardas interconnects . And just to prove that I am still an audiophile, I have been starting to peruse music servers wondering if maybe there something better out there ?
bpoletti, I am not challenging your science, because I simply don't know, but is it a scientific fact that "females generally have better hearing than males"?
Stevecham, from what I know that better listening abilities are derived from training on audiophile 'set of instructions' and better hearing or hearing for music is just natural that does not come with any training.
Females may have better hearing, on average, so the question is, does better hearing necessarily translate to better listening ability? I would challenge that assumption because I see no evidence of a correlation let alone a causal relationship.
I think part of the problem is trying to determine this by whether someone posts on a chat board. Most of the folks here in my experience are pretty helpful, and if anything, anti-bragging/bling, but the one upsmanship of the high end is tiring to me, and i expect that most women --call me sexist--would find it very typical male behavior. We are, after all, a bunch of geeks, right? So, is it possible that there are women audiophiles who don’t have a need to plug in constantly on a board like this one? (I get the social aspect of this, and generally enjoy it, I don’t think web fora are exclusively male by any means, but I could also see how "gear talk" might be a drag, I dunno). I’ve met women in all kinds of professions that you’d think of as traditionally male-dominated- racing car drivers- Denise McCluggage, who won Sebring back in 1961 or so; one of our family friends is a very highly ranked military officer with all the bells and whistles and I’d trust her with my life; I’m not "PC" but the Internet stays with you forever, so folks tend to be a little more circumspect, I think. As to CZ, he made a remark a few years ago that I took issue with, but my experience with CZ on the board is that he is basically OK. I miss Elizabeth too. Does anyone know what’s up w/her? Is she OK?
PS: raise your hand if I told you this (nursing home rules), but the first time my now wife visited my place when we were dating, she said, "Oh Quads." I had a pair of Quad ’57s as my midrange speaker at the time. How the hell did she know that? She worked part time for a mad audiophile, Chuck Lamonica, a well known "food photographer" in NY whose studio was also audio shipping and receiving. We became very good friends with Chuck and his wife as a couple; sadly, Chuck passed away in 1991, but my wife and I have been together 30 years now. She is not an audiophile, but a pretty tolerant individual. I say this in part because having to live with me would probably drive most people crazy.
BTW, I could (but won’t) name approximately a dozen members of the fairer sex who have posted here in recent times on at least an occasional basis. As well as at least one designer/manufacturer of respected high end electronics, and several reviewers and manufacturer’s representatives.
Agree with Almarg here - several of the fairer sex have posted on Audiogon. Several names come to mind. Plus, there are atleast 4 audio manuf/designers of the opposite sex that immediately come to mind....
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