"How about the Proac D2, or should I stay away from the
Proac since they require more powerful Amplifier.
Topten (Threads | Answers | This Thread)"
I don't know if I'm too late but I just noticed that statement in your post. ProAc speakers sometimes look difficult to drive on paper, but in reality are not difficult at all. The impedance tends to stay consistent, and not drop too low. The NAD amp you have won't have any problem driving them. |
With speakers as good as Focal...I would at least try a sub...many different options and price points... |
Check out the Nola boxer. If you decide to go with the boxer
you should also get the Sound Anchor loudspeaker stands. This is very important. This combination won "best of show" award at RMAF 2012. It was driven by a Rogue integrated tube amplifier. |
Have you considered the KEF LS50? I heard these at AXPONA this year, pulled very much into the room and they produced nice bass. Here is a video of the setup I listened to - not for the sound, but to show how far they were from the rear wall and still had nice bass. |
I have a 12' x 24' living space and the Wharfedale Jade 3s fill that room and have amazingly deep bass. They're pretty much like a sealed design and very easy to place. Also a very neutral speaker, if that is your preference. Good luck. |
I've heard good things about the Ryan R610 |
You might have enough power, but the Proac's deserve a much better amplifier... |
THANK YOU ALL on your opinions.
I narrowed my choice to the Carbon 7se and the Proac D2.
Mr.Fritz confirmed that Carbon 7se would sound nice with the
NAD. How about the Proac D2, or should I stay away from the
Proac since they require more powerful Amplifier. |
Clearwave Duet 6 monitors might do it for you. I like them so I'm biased so I had a high end dealer over for a listen just to make sure I wasn't going mad and he thought highly of them and said he could listen to them all day long. He even inquired if Clearwave made a floor stander.
The only caveat he had was that there was a bit too much bass for my room and he felt the padding under my carpet added too much instability which aided (but smeared) bass response and kind of rolled off the highs so I got some ceramic flagstone and put them under the stands and it went a ways to quell the problem.
I still might try the least expensive Symposium plates between the speakers and stands but I've come to realize just how flat the response is up high. With my old Tonians and the ribbon tweeter cymbal strikes and crashes sounded 'in your face' which grew kind of old after 5 years. Now the cymbals are where the drums are and not overdone. It all depends on the recording techniques.
The only thing that may be an issue is your amp. Although the watts are enough, not all watts are equal. It's like horsepower in a car: two cars will measure the same but have different torque curves and perform quite differently.
All the best,
Nonoise |
Kef R300's do bass, and everything else very well.. |
The Fritz Carbon 7s would be an excellent choice, for way less than 4k. Fritz is a great guy to talk to as well.
I think Jl35 is right to wonder if you should consider more amp, if you are willing to go 4k on speakers. You might well be able to detectably best the NAD.
So you might think about how to allocate your budget. (eg, the Carbon 7s and a used Cronus Magnum -- to pick an amp at random -- come in at under 4 combined). I seem to swap out speakers much more frequently than my amps, so I might put more into the juice.
John |
"04-14-15: Fritzspeaks
Hey! Knock it off already you knuckleheads... You know who you are."
Sorry, I wouldn't want you to loose a sale.
"Any opinions on Fritzspeakers Carbon 7 SE Speakers.
Good reviews, but I don't know how they would sound with
the NAD." |
The logical choice then to extend teh low end yet retain the would seem to be larger Focals in the same line.
The other affordable Focal line I have heard and like a lot is the Profile line. Check the specs, measurements reviews of particular models to identify the larger ones, most likely two larger floor standers rather than the smaller monitors, with more low end extension. |
Mapman
That's the right question. I am looking for the speakers
with low end extension and at the same time to keep quality
of the Focal highs. Again, I really like the sound of the NAD, punchy bass and extended highs after I replaced the stock jumpers. Two days ago I received private E-mail from the
one of the fellow Audiogoner with the suggestion to try
Carbon 7 SE Speakers. Bass goes low to 38 Hz but he is not
sure how they would sound with the NAD C356. |
What you have would seem to be pretty good on paper in regards to bass for a room that size.
What aspects of bass are you looking to improve? Low end extension and/or quantity? Quality/detail articulation? Or maybe all of teh above?
Or another way to ask it is have you heard a system anywhere that has the sound you want? If so what was the setup that did it?
Its much easier to hit a target if one knows exactly what the target is. "decent/better" bass alone is not much to go on.
Thanks. |
+1 Simao. It seems that for some it is just too easy to take offense to something posted. Almost as if they are looking for that opportunity.
Topen, I tend to agree with J135, in that with your budget of $4000 you are in a position to find an amp/speaker combination that better provides what you are seeking. |
Hey! Knock it off already you knuckleheads... You know who you are. |
Can we stop ankle biting and address the OP's questions? Seriously. I hate it when people hijack a thread for their own aural-ideological differences. |
Maplegrovemusic
At this point, I don't know what else to say other than you're a complete waste of food. |
Zd , You pulled out one sentence out of a million and defend yourself in a whole on that one sentence ? No one really cares who and what you recommend . I surely do not . The constant quotes of members thoughts , idea's and recommendations is aggressive to say the least . You try to justify it by calling it open dialogue or discussion . When it is just uncalled for . |
"04-12-15: Zd542
"04-11-15: Roxy54
Users and reviewers speak well of "The Clue."
That's because they don't have one."
I believe that this post really upset a few people. It was just a humorous comment aimed at reviewers. I've seen most of the other posters on this web site make similar comments. Of course, I'm the one who gets attacked for it. Read the last sentence of my last post. |
"04-13-15: Roxy54
Zd542
I think that a lot of people (myself included) are tired of your habit of using a discourse on any subject as an excuse for being abusive. You alternate between bad puns and nasty jabs.
Maplegrove is right. It's just getting old. "
If you can give me an example of me doing this, I'll be more than happy to apologize. |
""the bass is in a different league than what you have now " zd ,Speaking in absolutes
"that said the model 1's are hard to beat . You should like them". How do you have any idea if he will like them ? He should like them ? One of the dumbest statements i have read recently . I could dissect zd's posts for hours and bring to light the terrible suggestions ,but only so much time in the day .
Maplegrovemusic (System | Threads | Answers | This Thread)"
I can tell you for sure that I was spot on about the retard comment I made. First, everyone is complaining that I talk in absolutes. I then ask for you guys to read my post, and to your credit, you actually do. But this is where the retard part comes in. Looking at this;
"You should like them". How do you have any idea if he will like them ?"
Well, by me saying the OP should like them, proves that I'm not talking in absolutes. Should is not definite. And to even ask how would I have any idea that the OP would like them? Vandersteen's are usually respected for their bass. If you are looking for a speaker that has good bass, Vandersteen is a name that typically comes up. I even go so far to say that if the OP doesn't like the Vandersteen's for some reason, I gave an alternate recommendation of Monitor Audio. The thing that makes this whole conversation so ridiculous is that I clearly lay all this out right from the beginning, with no attitude or ambiguity whatsoever.
Just to clarify, I stand by my recommendation of the Vandersteen model 1's, and Monitor Audio. If anyone doesn't like my recommendations, that's OK. We all like different things. For the people that are attacking me for making these recommendations, you can kiss my ass. |
Topten - $4000 for speakers or for amp and speakers? I believe most $4000 speakers would need something better than the NAD you have. |
Check out Ascend's Sierra-1 monitors. Sierra-2's don't go as low. |
((Chrshanl37 I agree johnny when and only when they are set up to properly Vandersteens sound great but off axis not so much.))
What you can try to improve off axis response is if in a rectangle room, is much wider then normal spacing, try sitting within the triangle, speakers closer to the side walls with just a bit of toe in and nail the first reflection with diffusion as well as secondary reflection on the opposing wall.
Best JohnnyR
Vandersteen dealer |
I agree johnny when and only when they are set up to properly vandersteens sound great but off axis not so much. Kinda like the clues they need to be set up properly or they won't measure well either. |
Wow , You are a dealer huh ? It makes you a living , keeps you alive with food and shelter . Defend until the end ? I now see why you wanted to defend zd since he exclusively recommends Vandersteen . Are you an Ayre dealer as well . You seem like the prototype dealer . Every post you enter here should state you are a dealer so we can skip over your biased input . |
((Maple. Do you tell people what they will like too))
When I set up the Vandies text book correct in most rooms its so different compared to a mini box and pretty hard to resist for most folks.
All i am stating is the facts,a genuine observation based on real life experience which you cant seem to handle. Hey they might not be your cupa, but many compare them using live recordings and studio and get it more then do not.
Best JohnnyR
(((Audioconnection , If you are going to chime in on Roxy54's recommendation of "the clue" being a clueless suggestion then give your own recommendation for the speaker the op should buy . You must have the "correct" answer with all that knowledge you have .
Maplegrovemusic))
Thank you. yes I agree, FYI its the 9th post from the top
Best JohnnyR |
Zd the only one putting words in you mouth is audioiconnection. Again when you skewered roxy for his suggestion of the clue and said they are clueless you are speaking in absolutes. You go on to say that it is not that hard to get anyone to say anything about anything. How do you know thats what they are doing? What proof do you have of this? Why is your opinion passed of as fact on this? Further moore who the f#$# are you to say they are clueless if they like them? Roxy did not tell him to go out and buy the speaker he said people like them and maplegrove did not tell the op to go out and buy the actives he told the op to listen to some.
Then you go on to say there is no guarantee they will like actives....well no shit sherlock thats why its called a suggestion. There is no gaurantee the op will like anything thats been suggested including vandersteens thats why nobody here said run out and purchase this or that. Also I'm puzzled as to why you use sales of vandies as a baseline for customer satisfaction. Are you saying everyone who bought vandersteens kept them? Again how do you know this where do you get these facts? Bose has huge sales numbers as well so are we now to assume based on your logic they are in the same league? Adcom was the highest selling amp of all time too does that mean everyone the bought one still owns an adcom? Hell no.
And speaking of specs and measurements Johnny your telling us zd was using ja measurements of the clue to base hIs assertion that anyone who suggests them are clueless? So now we are back to zd's pet peeve which is blindly assuming how something will sound based on numbers vs actually listening? We should all buy are speakers and make recommendations now based on Johns measurements?
Again this sounds to me like speaking in absolutes. Idk maybe I'm wrong.
|
Audioconnection , If you are going to chime in on Roxy54's recommendation of "the clue" being a clueless suggestion then give your own recommendation for the speaker the op should buy . You must have the "correct" answer with all that knowledge you have . |
Audioconnection , You assume you know peoples emotional states ? Your recent post is a emotional incoherent rambling. You like zd's brand recommendations . Fine, look closer at how he states them . Telling someone he will like the Vandersteen ? Never heard a more preposterous statement . Do you tell people what they will like too ?
You folks who shill specific brands repeatedly because you like them is strictly ego driven . Anyone can repeatedly shill a brand . Open your ears and minds . |
Roxy 54
Thanks for your comments.
Quoting JAs measurements
((It must be remembered that the Clue is intended to be used when placed flush with the wall behind it. However, as the nearfield measurement technique assumes just such a condition, this graph therefore correlates with HR's finding the speaker's low frequencies to sound lean. And note the high-Q resonance in the port's output at 800Hz.))
In all fairness and not to be nasty for the OP i also agree and think the Clue would be clueless for him as ZD stated.
To be nice when you see statements like this,if you were him and had a solid opinion makes it hard to resist from being cynical.
There's got to be a little fun for him in being correct
Best JohnnyR |
Hi John,
I know you, and have purchased from you, and have sat with you and had a number of very pleasant and enjoyable discussions while listening to music (usually on Vandersteens), and you have taught me a great deal without any of the confrontational crap that Zd spouts on a regular basis.
If you go back to the earlier part of this thread, he started up when I suggested that the OP check out "The Clue" speaker, which I admit I have never heard. Read his response, and then tell me his posts are instructive.
As I said, I think a number of members are probably tired of his poor attitude.
John |
((I think that a lot of people (myself included) are tired of your habit of using a discourse on any subject as an excuse for being abusive. You alternate between bad puns and nasty jabs.
Maplegrove )))
WTF
First of all lets be fair "think Logic ,facts and experience"
I look at ZD posts and think he is pretty much spot on 98 percent of the time. If you had the experience it would all make more sense to you.
Perhaps if you can get past emotional pride response and stay open minded you may just learn something.
We need more folks that speak from their own real challenges, discoveries,and errors instead of confused jargon emotional response on how to get there from what he said, she said on someone else's rig.
JohnnyR |
I second the Aon 3 or Aon 2.
You gotta hear these. |
zd's first post on the original subject to break down : Or, should I try Floor standing speakers. Thank you in advance on yours opinions.
Topten (Threads | Answers | This Thread)"
I think a floor standing speaker would be a much better way to go. See if you can audition a pair of Vansersteen Model 1's. They're very easy to drive and the bass is in a different league than what you have now. If for some reason, you don't like them, listen to some Monitor Audio floor standers. The silver series is very nice. That said, the Model 1's are hard to beat. You should like them.
"the bass is in a different league than what you have now " zd ,Speaking in absolutes
"that said the model 1's are hard to beat . You should like them". How do you have any idea if he will like them ? He should like them ? One of the dumbest statements i have read recently . I could dissect zd's posts for hours and bring to light the terrible suggestions ,but only so much time in the day . |
I will second the Ref3A de Capos, surprising bass for a smallish speaker and damn fine sounding |
lsa statement one montiors, exceptional bass |
I think that a lot of people (myself included) are tired of your habit of using a discourse on any subject as an excuse for being abusive. You alternate between bad puns and nasty jabs.
Maplegrove is right. It's just getting old. Amen to that Roxy54. I had a run in with this cat in another forum on this site. Now I don't know who this guy is, and I really don't care, but I do care when I am have a constructive dialog with an OP and he needlessly interjects. Further, in my case, he totally misconstrues the point I was making so that just indicates to me, this is some sort of compulsive behavior. I'll just leave it at that. |
I am really sorry to see that the thread caused the arguments. It is all about the taste and "the ears".
Any opinions on Fritzspeakers Carbon 7 SE Speakers.
Good reviews, but I don't know how they would sound with
the NAD.
For the owners of the NAD C356, just replace the stock
jumpers with the Cardas jumpers and you will get the great sound. Tight deep bass and the crisp highs. Even my friend
who is "just the tubes" thinks that the NAD sounds good.
Of course, any better interconnects would be great improvement but somehow the Cardas works the best with the NAD. |
Wtf?
Didn't sound like ZD was speaking in absolute truths to me... Seems that he has quite a bit of experience with powered speakers, and just gave his oppinions like we all do. He's right about Vandersteens too. I think quite a few people actually do like them.
Strange twist of thread; usually its not the knowldgeable ones arguing. I'm grabbin some popcorn and a chair. |
Zd542
I think that a lot of people (myself included) are tired of your habit of using a discourse on any subject as an excuse for being abusive. You alternate between bad puns and nasty jabs.
Maplegrove is right. It's just getting old. |
If you guys are going to challenge me on an issue read my post first. Don't put words in my mouth.
"For the most part, my last post is a mix of personal opinion and common sense."
" I have yet to hear actives that can compete realisticly with well matched separates costing the same or less. To be fair, I most likely have different taste's than most. For example, I like Ayre for solid state."
"To sum up, regardless of the type of speaker you buy, active, passive, or partial, the selection process doesn't change. Buying an active speaker guarantees you absolutely nothing with regards to sound quality. And why should it?"
How exactly am I talking in absolutes here? Anyone who comes to that conclusion is an absolute retard.
04-12-15: Maplegrovemusic
zd is the king of quotes . Quoting peoples opinions and stating reasons why he thinks they are wrong . Getting very old quickly .
Some people would call that a conversation. And if you're not willing to debate an issue, then you're the one who speaks in absolutes.
"Just going to start giving him a taste of his own medicine.
Maplegrovemusic (System | Threads | Answers | This Thread)"
You're not smart enough to do that.
"Aplogies for the rant I just think there is a lot of opinion expressed on here passed off as fact and it does this site and the members a disservice."
Except when it comes to you. Your guesses get to be facts.
"You like vandies as do many others for the various reasons you have stated on other threads. I dont care for them and the amount of other people who dont like or own them far out weigh those that do."
I have no idea what book you got those facts from. But if so many people have a negative opinion of Vandersteen, then how is it that the Model 2 is the best selling high end speaker in the history of high end audio? There isn't another speaker that even comes close in terms of units sold?
Maybe you guys should stop being a bunch of cry babies and put more effort into learning about audio. From reading your posts, its clear that most of you are lacking in this regard. |
Reference 3A de Capo's. All the tight bass you'll ever need. Those or a good pair of Dynaudio 1.4 |
Also where in the thread were mini box speakers recommended? I recall active monitors being suggested but I must have missed the mini suggestion. |
Audioconnection you were careful to choose the word "most" instead of "all" which would make your statement about mini box speakers untrue. Thank you for making my point about speaking in absolutes. |
zd is the king of quotes . Quoting peoples opinions and stating reasons why he thinks they are wrong . Getting very old quickly . Just going to start giving him a taste of his own medicine . |
try the GoldenEar's Aon 3 or Aon 2. |
"Maplegrovemusic
If you do this long enough you realize ZD is just making
an simple observation with coherence."
If you do this long enough you should know that when giving advice based on opinions you should not speak in absolutes . I have no problem with stating what one likes in this hobby . We all do it for the most part .When one tries to justify the opinions as facts is where it becomes nonsense . There were too many statements made by zd in his post that were just his opinion followed by untruths . |
