Bluesound mode not really cutting it

OP Received the Cambridge cvx v2. The dac sounded flat.

Surprisingly, the MXN10 feeding directly into my Parasound sounds great, just as several reviewers have mentioned—definitely not a wall of sound. Perhaps Black Ice is in a relatively different league in SS. I did upgrade its power cable to Pangea.

Problems  like this is why ,I'm glad that I d stream...

Nos, but I'll try the black plates. Thx for info. 

@sgnevling 

NOS Mullard or Reissues ? I tried mine with reissues and wasn’t happy. Went with GE 5751 Black Plates and am blown away. 

Matched pair of Mullard 12ax7 ,They were recommended on a different thread somewhere. The Black Ice dac beat the Schiit Yaggrisil on one of the Dac tests. Wish it had remote Id bypass the Saga Plus altogether. 

@sgnevling 

I have that DAC as mentioned in a previous response…

What tubes are you running with ?

Received the Cambridge cvx v2. The dac sounded flat. Reconnected Black Ice dac and walla nice combination. Noticable sound difference from node. More intent and sparkle. More midrange silkyness. Had to order proper USB cable. So using coaxial at moment. All in all happy. See how long before the itch to upgrade comes back...Thx to all for sharing experience 

In that price range you could get a Lumin D2 used or even the Newer D3. 
excellent product, balanced performance and good connectivity. 
 

Are you running stock tubes in the BlackIce DAC?

What USB cable are you using?

I know you have a used CXN v2 on the way but for $300 the LHY LPS helped my Node a lot.

I have a Node 2i. I stream mostly from Amazon Music HD and Idagio. I have looked into upgrading to a higher end streamer, but I cannot find anything that supports these two streaming services. (Innuos supports Idagio, but not Amazon, and has no intention of supporting Amazon in the future.) I moded my Node 2i with a Teddy Pardo LPS and the improvement was significant! Deeper sound stage, more detail, better bass, just better overall! I am bypassing the built in DAC, and using the coax out to a PS Audio Directstrem DAC Mk. 1, that has been moded by APS Transformers. So far, I am very happy with the sound. I too am awaiting the reviews for the upcoming Node Icon. I'm wondering if the streaming section is improved, or just the built in DAC, which I know is improved. It would be nice if Bluesound would produce a truly audiophile streamer with a LPS and no DAC, with an XLR or I2s output.

Thx for all the input. Decided to give a used Cambridge Cxn v2 a run. Will give input when it arrives. 

@helomech I owned A6 for a 30-day period, auditioned Node X and now had MXN10 under my possession (and planned to keep it for my 2nd system). Here are my impressions: A6 -> a bit too bright and SS is within speakers. Nothing special not worth the hype. Node X -> is just a bit too warm to my ear. MXN10 -> richer sounding, weightier bass, treble has a bit rounded edge so it was perceived less articulated than A6 but details are there. The overall tonal balance is right. All of the above opinions pertain to the internal DAC. Your experience may vary, but this is completely normal, especially in music listening. Enjoy!

TMR has a Bryston BDA-3.14 streaming DAC. The Manic Moose interface is a POS but the Bryston is Roon ready. Load Roon on your home computer and use the BDA as a Roon end point. Bryston DAC sounds smooth, laid back and has plenty of warmth. Exactly the sound signature you seek. 
https://tmraudio.com/components/d-a-converters/bryston-bda-3-14-network-streaming-dac-d-a-converter/

However, you have a bottleneck in your system - your schiit preamp. May be worth ditching your entire low-fi front end (BS, Schiit and Glass) for something like the used Simaudio Moon 390 which is an all in one DAC/Streamer/Preamp here. 
https://tmraudio.com/components/music-servers-streamers/simaudio-moon-neo-390-dac-streamer-d-a-converter/

Sorry to post so many times, but it just occurred to me that since your Black Ice DAC has a volume control, have you VERY CAREFULLY set it properly and hooked it directly to your amp and bypassed the Schiit Saga, just to answer the question of whether or not the Saga might be your weak point? At least you’d know one way or the other. I like Schiit gear and think it is fine, but well, it is worth a try.

@skiznfliz thanks for that info on tube rolling with the Black Ice FX DAC. I would hazard a guess that there is likely a discussion forum somewhere on doing just that. Glad you found some NOS tubes that can bring the magic. Maybe the OP should try that as well before buying a new digital streaming transport. 

@audioman58 Yes, the Node is "good" and at $600 has been considered "the" entry level streamer to get for many years until WiiM came along with their lineup which includes their well-reviewed "Ultra". Currently the Node is on discount for $349 since Bluesound is doing a refresh of their streamer line up. Even at the $349 price, you have to figure they are still making about $150 on it. Mark up of devices is just part of the game when buying consumer items, especially those made in communist China. But hey, everyone wants to save a buck I guess. So many speaker manufacturers have theirs manufactured there it is hard to avoid at most sane price points. 

+1 CXN100 or its budgetary ed. MXN10

The MXN10 is a joke compared to the Node IME. In addition to the fact the Cambridge doesn’t sound any better, its UI was obviously designed for the tech illiterate. It allows almost zero customization of anything. The owners might as well use the native app of their chosen streaming service.

For a couple hundred more, the Eversolo A6 is a superior unit in every regard. 

There is nothing wrong with the Bluesound Node when used with a competent external DAC. It wouldn’t constitute a bottleneck even if your system were anchored with $20K speakers. Its UI is better than most as well.

You would be far better off investing that $3K into better speakers, and to a lesser extent, better amplification. 
 

I am not familiar with the Black Ice DAC, but if it’s one of those that incorporates a tube buffer, then chances are you’d get a considerable improvement by moving to one of the perfect-measuring “Chi-Fi” units from Topping or SMSL. Even if, say, your system was anchored with $12K speakers, the Node and a Topping DAC would not be your bottleneck. It’s far more likely that the room or those $12K speakers would still be your bottleneck. 

I’ll be in the minority here - but the problem is not the node. It’s your DAC or preamp. The node is just serving the file so to speak. 

You have to realize a $600 streamer is maybe $150 from China 

you can’t expect much ,

innuos has a nice little one $1500 retail , then upgrade power supply later to a LPS .

@jetter , I too have the Node 2i with the PD Creative LPS and was happy with it. I am a tinkerer and am currently using a NUC with Roon or a Volumio streamer. For our casual listening I am invested in the Bluesound ecosystem and it is nice being able to connect and transfer music between devices.

I know it’s not their main focus, but I wish Bluesound would develop a standalone streamer to compete with the lower level devices from Aurender,  Innuous, and similar level. I think that market doesn’t care about the upgraded headphone output, larger touchscreen, and built-in DAC.

@moonwatcher

I have the Black Ice Glass FX DAC and opted to have it sent with the Sovtec 12AX7 LPS tubes and it sounded pretty good connected to my Bluesound N130. But then I swapped the tubes out to 1960 NOS GE5751 Triple Mica Black Plates and it sounds fantastic. Feeding via USB and connected to an Odyssey Candela Tube PreAmp utilizing 1960 NOS GE Triple Mica 5814A Black Plate Tubes. Recently just auditioned it at our Audiophile’s Frankensystem Event and the general consensus amongst the attendees was impressive, sounded great and very musical. It’s a good little DAC, just have to find the right tube synergy for your system.

Get yourself a Teddy Pardo power supply for your BlueSound Node.

   Hi , I would like to share my experience that occurred over the past two weeks. I have been running a Project Streambox Ultra II. I have both Tidal and Qbuzz. My streamer is hardwired and I have two usb cables, a Cardas Clear, and Wireworld Starlight Platinum 8. My DAC is a Schiit Yiggy into a Rogue Pre. My system is resolving enough that I can tell a definite difference in cables. I started with a laptop then went to the Project over the Node about 3 years ago. About 3 weeks ago my Project would not recognize my DAC, I put it back to factory settings started over, but no luck. Since I was already looking for something better and being cost driven, I purchased a used Innuos Pulse Mini that came with a Zero Zone LPS for $975. I believe the LPS is Chinese but it’s pretty well built. So my Innuos arrived and I downloaded the app and began the setup. What happened was it wouldn’t recognize my Yiggy thru the USB. So I hooked it up with a Morrow digital coax. I’m using the Innuos operating software and running Tidal and Qbuzz. The sound is a noticeable improvement over the Project. So during this process I hooked up my old laptop to my Yiggy thru USB and it played fine. But again the Pulse Mini would not recognize it. I began to wonder if the Pulse was meant to output USB, so I emailed Innuos support. I received a response from Daniel C the same day. In asking about the Pulse I mentioned my issue with my Schiit DAC. He responded by stating the the Pusle does recognize thru USB. He went so far as to research my First Generation Yiggy and tell me that my Gen III input card was the issue and to contact Schiit. I did, he was correct and I’m in the process of shipping my DAC to Schiit for the UNISON USB card. I am absolutely astounded at Innuos support for going that deep for someone with a used item and no warranty. So to answer your question upgrade your streamer Vs putting money into it. At your price point get the “ Pulse“ over the mini because it’s a tad newer and has a nice LPS built in. There are some good reviews. If you want just a streamer look at the Innuos Pulse and the Aurender N150. Most dealers will sell tax free or you can find a open box for about $1K less. As far as streamers and cables not making a difference, I have to call BS. I think we all have our experiences my experience is not the absolute rule. I also believe that the rule of diminishing returns apply, but there are big tiers of improvement and I exist in a Mid Fi  home and this is a Hi Fi arena. Happy Hunting, Mike B. 

I have the Node 130.  I added a Teddy Pardo linear power supply to it, and that obviously improved its sound.  If you like the Bluesound app and want to stream wi-fi, adding a LPS is a cost-effective way to improve the Node.  Teddy Pardo claims it brings its sound quality up to the level of $2000 streamers.  I heard a clearer rendering of the soundstage and a bit more "meat on the bones" with the timbre of instruments.

I use a Node (Gen 3) with a PD Creative LPS (excellent Polish company and highly recommended) connected to my Denafrips Ares 12th. Pre-amp is a Schiit Saga 2. Power is provided by an NAD S200 into Dynaudio Special 40's. The LPS and pre-amp upgrade made all the difference. Total cost to me was around $4K. Used or demo except for the Schiit. Toslink to the Denafrips as I use the Denafrips coaxial for my CD transport. 

Ronboco, glad its not just me. I bought a stylus which helps hitting the dots, but it doent work on the phone. Also I think the most frustrating part is that is clears the que. It would be nice if the 3 dot are was independant of the song title.

Hopefully the software writer reads Audiogon

Our Node2i sends its signal by glass Toslink cable to an Emotiva XDA3 dac out to 500 watt Red Dragon monoblocks out to Yamaha NS-5000 speakers. The Node is hard wired to a fiber optic modem. There's also a Rhythmik G25HP double ender subwoofer crossed at 30hz.

We listen to internet radio relatively loudly in a large room all day long. Hawaiian Reggae, Grateful Dead, 70's music. We like it.

I think that the CA network player - the EXN100 and higher - has HDMI but that the CXN100 does not.

TM

Look at the BelCanto E.stream at about $2000.  Small but hefty, outplayed Innuous Pulse at $3800, No DAC.  Small difference to CD's.

Your choice of a tube stage DAC is an interesting one. The reviews of the Glass FX Tube DAC/DSD WiFi are good, but have you taken it as far as it will go with the PSVANE 12AX7-S tube upgrade over the stock tube? As good as it is, it is a $900 DAC - a very good one at that price point, but not a $2K DAC.

You are using an external DAC, not the one in the Node. The Node is only a transport. Yes, transports can make a difference, but I would venture that you’d get more bang for your bucks by trying a higher end DAC first, and then later on maybe another streaming transport.

I would also look to a DAC with USB input and configure the Node to use its USB jack as an OUTPUT to that external DAC and make sure the presumably better clock circuit in the external DAC is doing the driving for less jitter, not the clock in the Node.

In the meantime, you might look at doing one of the relatively inexpensive upgrades to a LPS for the Node. This could always be used in a secondary system you have, even if you do buy a better digital streaming transport later. Many swear that it makes a demonstrable difference in audio quality.

Oh, and you didn’t mention which output from the Node into the Black Ice DAC you are using? Have you tried the other outputs versus the one you are currently using? Worth a try. And do you have the DAC set to full volume output to bypass its internal volume control, and only control the volume via the Saga? 

@gkow4three Yes, both CXN100 or V2 (8) and MXN10 (4) have presets. 

I have node 2i. I put a new power supply on it. It goes to Topping AKM D90. The resolution is amazing. Every transient, fade out. These are both 5 years old with a total cost of about $1200.  Since I have switched to Qobuz I am having nothing but trouble.   Won't load content.  I am missing several thousand favorite songs.

I have  node 2i. I put a new power supply on it.  It goes to Topping AKM D90.  The resolution is amazing.  Every transient, fade out.  These are both 5 years old with a total cost of about $1200

@theo 

I too sometimes start the song by mistake. Doing that also clears the Que. You just have to make sure you are on those three dots on the right. They really should make it that wherever you touch the selection you get the choices you mentioned. 
 

Happy listening!

Ron 

Both good value and great sound˜

A step up

gkelly, I have a question about your Innuos Pulse Mini. Are you running it without the upgrade power supply. I was speaking with a dealer the other day and he was pushing the power supply, and although I realize I can always add it later, I am just curious on your results. I have a Node as well, most recent version, and am looking to take the next step. 
soix, you mentioned another brand of power supply. Was your decision on the PS you have based on upgrading for the OEM Innous PS or did you start with the PS you have? 
And a question for both of you, how would you compare the software to the Bluesound BluOS? My complaint with BluOS is the size of the song list trying to pick the option of 1) add to a playlist 2) play next or 3) play last. So many times I intend to make one of those choices and start that song unintentionally.

To the OP, sorry of this is interpreted as me hijacking your thread, but hopefully the answers I get will be of benefit to you as I imagine you have experienced this frustration with BluOS

I have a Bluesound Node N130 with upgraded power. I really like the 5 presets on top of it where I can just push a button and it plays (without having to go into my phone). For other players mentioned in this list, do they have presets? If it was pushing a couple of buttons on the device/screen, that might be ok. I've been wondering about this. 

Streamers aren't all the same.   You can buy an Eversolo and get terrible support or you can buy an Innuos or Aurender and get both great sound and support.  

Bluesound is a great platform and sounds pretty good for the money.  Best platform for the price Support is pretty good too.  

You can get a Bryston BDP-3 for about $1.5K used.  They stopped making them but will continue support. Manic Moose interface is antiquated vs the new stuff with apps. Only supports Qobuz and tidal but SQ is not notch for the spend. 

@oddiofyl +1 Streamers are all pretty much equivalent. No point in spending thousands of dollars when a WiiM Pro for $200 sounds no different than a four-figure streamer contrary to what the golden ears crowd claims.

Staying on question, IMHO, Aurender makes the best sounding streamers/servers.  A used N150 or better, an N10 (listed in this forum for around $2,300 and $3,500 respectively where list is always negotiable) is your best bet.  The bonus in buying a used server is that in may come with many high resolution downloaded to the drive on the internal drive. 

I'd probably toss the Mac152 and get a tube amp.

The new Bluesound Icon is scheduled to come out in November.  I have the node 2i and will be interested in seeing the reviews for the new Icon and perhaps purchasing it.

Bluesound Introduces Three New NODE Wireless Hi-Res Music Streamers With Class-Leading Performance

For your budget new I’d get an Innuos Pulse Mini and an external LPS from Teddy Pardo, LHY, Sbooster, etc. that would be mandatory for best sound.  In addition to upping sound quality significantly you’ll get their excellent app that won’t be a letdown coming from Bluesound’s likewise very good app, which is not a small consideration.  Alternatively you could get a used Innuos Zen for around the same price and no added LPS required.  Hope this helps, and best of luck. 

Except if you have any local files the Airlens will not play them without a seperàte server and DLNA.

The Node will.

I have some experience with the BSNode.  It was IMO "unresolving".

I have tried a few different streamers and under 2K my favorite (for now) is a PS Audio AirLens. I was skeptical about it's claims but their return policy made me willing to give it a try.  I kept it :)

+1 CXN100 or its budgetary ed. MXN10

https://www.stereophile.com/content/cambridge-audio-mxn10-streamer150da-processor#:~:text=(A%20Black%20Edition%20of%20the,in%20the%20January%202024%20issue.)

Innous Pulse Mini is a good-sounding and well-performing device. If you come from something like BlueSound Node, you should be able to notice a considerable uplift in performance that justifies its price tag. While I can find more accomplished digital streamers at this price, it’s not that easy to find a better DAC implementation.

I really like my CA CXN 100 which is a major step up from the Node.  I use the AirPlay and Chromecast features quite a bit.  They have just released a new streamer with a better DAC which you probably won’t need and an HDMI ARC, which you might use.  

I would change out the preamp , DACs are pretty good nowadays.  A great preamp makes a big difference in my experience.