I have dedicated audio room 14.5x20.5x9 ft. Currently have Marantz Reference CD/Intergrated paired to Magnepan 1.7's with REL T-7 subs. For the vast majority of music I love this system. The only nit pick is that it is lacking/limited in covering say below 35 hz or so. For the first time actually buzzed the panel with an organ sacd. Bummer. Thought of upgrading subs to rythmicks but then I will need to high pass the 1.7's. Really don't want to deal with that approach.
Enter the Double Impacts. Many interesting things here. Would certainly have a different set of strengths here. Dynamics, claimed bottom octave coverage in one package, suspect a good match to current electronics.
I've read all the threads here so we do not need to rehash that. Just wondering if others out there have FIRST HAND experience with these or other Tekton speakers
I'd stay up all night too if I was Ezra.....as it is I'm up early. The Chicagoland area is blessed with having the DI's, SE's and Ulfbehrts to hear. I need to make a trip down there. If Ezra is enjoying the SE's this much now, just imagine how much he will be enjoying them once they are broken in. I expect the bass to get better yet along with even better mids, more smoothness and improved imaging. The SE's could be the pinnacle speaker for me.....hopefully I can swing buying a pair soon.
Evolvist, Well, to be frank there’s no "you’re so full of crap part" I’m sorry you perceive my inquiry and comments this way. Yes I am aware of the obtaining that last 1 % level and this final quest can often be an expensive commitment. All of this is understood. Your Pinto/Cadillac and sports ticket analogies confirm (to me ) you missed my point.
We do agree (I think) that by its very nature judging or determining value, true performance upgrade decisions, getting that final 1% are individually and subjectively rooted. I do believe that generally speaking you get what you have paid for. There are exceptions to this axiom, particularly so in High End audio.
In your case I clearly understand your reasoning and explanation for preferring the Linn over the Lyngdorf, makes perfect sense based on your experience with both. I do not question your choice of the Linn. My only observation is another listener could hear both and choose the Lyngdorf as "their"preference. That simple and nothing more. You could believe that they’re simply fooling themselves yet they may be absolutely genuine in their belief. This is the nature of subjectivity and perception.
Many audiophiles would/could be skeptical and dismissive of Ezra’s finding the Tekton Double Impact SE superior sounding to the "far" more expensive YG Acoustics, Magico and Sonus Faber he has owned. Actually I believe there are those who would flat out reject the very idea and probably question Ezra’s taste and hearing acumen. No way is this possible despite his and teajay’s opinion to the contrary. No way is this possible some would insist vociferously.
One could say that You and Ezra achieved that coveted 1 % in alternative ways. You by spending more for the Linn and Ezra by spending less for the DI SE relative to his more expensive former speakers. In both cases one could conclude, mission accomplished. Both of you are happy and satisfied with your respective choices. There are without question audio products that occupy different levels of a hierarchy. Most often than not you pay the cost of admission to get there.
Sometimes you can get there without paying this higher rate of admission. In Ezra’s situation this seems to be the happy outcome. Charles
You demonstrate wisdom in your writing's that I enjoy reading from you. Sometimes we forget that what we hear is subjective at best, and regardless of how much a component costs, someone would always prefer something of a lesser value based on sound alone. We all hear differently. Tekton is making dreams come through for some of us who want high-end sound for far less. BRAVO Tekton!!
@aolprodj Thank you for the end game summation statement! Perfect!
Thank you also for posting the photos of the Double Impact SEs at Ezra’s home. They look just a bit wider than the DIs; Are they? Any other differences that you picked up on?
@audioarchon Mike, do you have specs to share? Thanks.
I believe your summation was very succinct and en pointe! If I may add, since music- by it's very nature, is about conveying emotion, it would make sense that very feeling would carry over into our affinity towards whatever equipment helped get us there :-)
Hi david_ten - Allen measured the depth because they did not look any deeper...I believed they measured 19" deep vs. the standard DI @ 17.75". Let me ask Eric about the other specs and will post.
The SEs appear to have Eminenance 10s and 6s and what looks like another version of the SB acoustics tweeters. Just speculation from the pics. Thought I read these were going to be scanspeak drivers or similar.
@teajay Terry, really appreciate the immediate on-the-front reporting.
As you know, I ordered the DIs the day your review of them was posted on hometheaterreview.com without any other knowledge of / about them.
Just over a month ago you advised me on which of Eric's speakers would be the best fit for my needs. I choose the SEs based on those discussions. It appears your early read on the SEs has been substantiated, perhaps even more so than you predicted.
I put the order in for the SEs the same day. I know I don't have these speakers yet, but I would like to acknowledge you. I'm grateful for your guidance. Thank you.
Now that the SEs - I actually like the SI you used because I thought it sounded about right: Special Impacts! - are live, I'm hopeful that Eric can deliver mine as promised. I was number 3 in the queue a month ago, with Ezra's SEs being No. 1 and Eric estimated about a month.
I'm Really Excited. Can't wait for the pair of Mercedes Diamantsilber Metallic to get their finishing touches, hopefully once Eric is back and settled from a successful and productive RMAF. The photos @aolprodj shared of the SEs in the metallic black finish look very nice.
"
The SEs appear to have Eminenance 10s and 6s and what looks like another
version of the SB acoustics tweeters. Just speculation from the pics.
Thought I read these were going to be scanspeak drivers or similar.
"
The tweeters look like the same SB Acoustics SB26STCN-C000-4 that just arrived in my Electrons. They're lower cost than the
SB29RDCN-C000-4
ring radiators the other DI's seem to have (and the Electron's are advertised as having).
First post on this site and it’s going to be a long one. I’m not very active on forums other than creeping behind the scenes or doing research. But I have been following this thread in its entirety from the start and it has been quite informative.
@teajay It’s great to have your input here as well as everyone else who respectfully contributes. Especially the ones who have actual experience with this speaker and different equipment combos.
A little background on me. I’ve always been into audio all my life. My dad was an electronics technician and I have always had a hand me down system. But until 2 years ago, my main focus was on car audio and even more so, home theater. (Current system consists of Martin Logan Electromotion series 7.2 w/SVS Ultra subwoofers)
So fast forward the last two years and here’s the equipment I’ve run through. Naim Nait 5si amp, Primaluna Prologue One amp on KT 120’s, Martin Logan Motion 15 bookshelves augmented with Velodyne Minivee subs, Spatial Audio M3 Turbo S’s, Totem Element Embers and now the Tekton DI’s which I purchased used. I have also recently acquired a Line Magnetic 508 amp which I’ve got about 80 hours on now with stock tubes.
My current upstream equipment is as follows: Macbook Pro running Tidal Hi Fi/Audirvana to a 2Qute DAC to the Line Magnetic to the Tekton DI’s. I haven’t tried my analog rig yet as it’s packed up in anticipation of us moving. I’ve also ordered a Linear Tube Audio MZ2 which will be used on its own or in front of the Line Magnetic depending on my mood.
A couple caveats before I relay my opinion on the DI’s. I don’t lean toward the neutral/clinical sound. As I’ve always been into car audio and HT systems with dedicated subs, I do like my low frequency. I also like a rich, emotional midrange and with lots of detail on top minus any shrillness. (I guess I want everything) I can’t stand shouty, lean sounding or speakers that lose all dynamics and fun at low volumes. All my speaker cables and interconnects are generic and nothing special. I have only just begun to dive into that realm. I also have no room treatment for the 2 channel room. I’ve included pics to give you a better idea of where I’m coming from.
I mainly listen at moderate volumes where I can still hold a conversation with my wife but when I’m alone, things get louder. Of course after a few drams of Scotch, things can get much louder. My main musical tastes range from newer style folk, blues, reggae, and classic rock. Everything else is also fair game including country, hip hop and electronic. Just no death metal please.
So my take on the Tekton DI’s. Visually they are a bit over bearing, especially if you have a smaller room. Lol, no surprises there. I enjoy the look, my wife not so much. Sonically, they are not overbearing in the least and it’s truly amazing how light on their feet they are compared to their physical appearance.
They are very fast, dynamic and never get shouty or grainy on top. But they also aren’t lacking for detail in the least and I don’t ever see them getting fatiguing with my set up. I’m getting a beautiful lifelike midrange. During some listening sessions and recordings, I feel like I could almost move my head and look behind the singer’s head. I tell my wife it’s almost like watching a cartoon. I am new to the SET experience so this could be part of this.
They image like crazy and don’t require much toe in to achieve that. My Spatial M3’s had imaging that I didn’t think I could match again but these do it. My carpet must have 100 tiny holes from experimenting with placement. I ended up in nearly an equilateral 10 ft triangle with the speakers toed in just outside the sides of my couch. I’ve got the DI’s pulled out about 2 feet off the front wall for now. But to be honest there really wasn’t a placement that I found horrible. My goal was to have a realistically sized soundstage where everything stayed cohesive left to right.
Soundstage width is great, there’s still some recordings where an instrument or sound will pop out of no man’s land on either side of a speaker. Check out “Dock of the Bay by Lincoln Mayorga and Distinguished Colleagues on the Sheffield/AT2B Test Disc” on Tidal. Turn it up and see if you can find the saxophone. Lol. Soundstage depth is average to me.
I’m stealing someone else’s words here but I can agree with the statement that they almost sound like a panel with more meat on the bones especially in the midrange. It’s also been said before that live recordings are great with these speakers and I agree. I’ve never listened to so many live recordings ever. They are amazing on these.
But…and this is my only real negative about these speakers. The bass. I’m not used to the way these speakers portray the bass. The visceral, physical impact of the bass just isn’t there for me right now. I can audibly hear that these speakers play low in my room. The bass “sounds” great but doesn’t seem to do the music justice like the rest of the frequency spectrum. It almost reminds me of the open baffle Spatial M3’s I had. The bass was there but it wasn’t ever that satisfying.
Compared to my Martin Logan Electromotions with a single 8” woofer, down firing port and only play down to a spec’d 42hz, the DI’s are sort of a let down in this area, especially considering the 2 10” woofers in a large ported enclosure.
Another interesting aspect of the bass compared to the ML Electros is the ML’s seemed to always have great bass in most every music, genre and recording. Now if the DI’s are playing a recording that has great bass in it, it will definitely pressurize the room and get down and boogie on the low frequencies. But if the recording has only “ok” bass such as a lot of classic rock tunes, the DI’s can sound quite lean which is disappointing. One more interesting fact is that when I move further toward the rear wall of my room, the bass is so much better. This is totally to be expected due to room modes. And once I move into my new home, the listening couch will be nearly against a back wall so this may become a non-issue for me. And yes, I realize this is a no no in the audio world! But it may bring me to my happy place which is what this is all about.
I’m hoping between upgraded speaker cables and interconnects and tweaking, I can get these speakers to what I think they’re capable of in the low frequencies. Because to me, everything else about them is end game sound quality and I’d love to keep them. The sound is truly addictive and just plain fun!
I also understand I could probably achieve better low end with a solid state amp or something other than my Line Magnetic. But I don’t want to give up the rest of the sound characteristics and beautiful looks of this amp. And to be fair, the Line Magnetic provides plenty of bass on the other speakers I tried it with so I don’t think it’s all amp related. Upgraded tubes may be another avenue down the road. I do have a JL Audio E110 sub that I could integrate but with the size of the DI’s, a sub is a no go for me and I don't want to risk taking anything away from the DI sound.
I’m also very open to any suggestions, thanks guys and girls.
Anyways, just some thoughts from a fellow normal audio and music lover. Great forum!
@hfaddict, tighten up all the screws to all the drivers with a Phillips head screwdriver. You may be suprised at how loose they are or have gotten. I was. Not saying it's gonna make a night and day difference to what you are hearing but it's free and may help.
hfaddict, I get tons and tons of bass, on the verge of too much. Always recording dependent of course. Rock is usually too compressed to get a lot of bass out. Live recordings are simply amazing, stunning, and the bass rocks it. I have found that sitting in the sweet spot that the bass is perfect, outside of that it is ok, unless the volume is pumped. Cabling and fuses can make a difference there as well. Thank you for your informative post!
@charles1dad - Here's the rub: I didn't mention the cost of the Linn in my original post, only it's features. You, and others, brought price into the conversation, which is cool, but as the conversation morphed it became apparent to me that we were no longer talking about SQ, alone, but SQ+$$$. That's cool, too.
Me, like everybody else who doesn't consider dollars to be a status symbol, would much rather take the less expensive item that sounds great over the more expensive item that also sounds great. Yet, even though I didn't imagine this conversation would turn into money, I played along under the premise that yes, sometimes the better product does come at a premium, even though you saved a ton of money on all of the other products in your system.
It's the nature of this thread, though, isn't it? If I agree with everyone (which I have) that the DIs kill much more expensive speakers, everybody gives me a pat on the back. If, on the other hand, I suggest that a piece of upstream gear that costs more is better than one that costs less, the reaction is, "Whoah, okay, let's examine this. It goes against the premise of this thread." I didn't mention money, nonetheless, it came up, which tells me that this has become more agenda driven over the openness to why one person chose the Linn over the Lyngdorf. My choice had nothing to do with cash, and it still doesn't (at least to me). Even the DIs have little to do with money. The cost of the DIs is merely a boon. Since my pockets are not deep, of course I'm thrilled over the DI's price, yet I want performance, first, so if the DIs had come in at $7500 a pair, I wouldn't balk at them. Would you?
Wait, do you own the DIs?
It's true, there are a lot of hi-fi items priced too high. I tried to save money by going with Geico in 15 minutes or less. It just didn't take hold. I'll leave it at that.
Thanks @greg22lz I think you are onto something there that maybe I couldn’t quite put into the right context.
As I mentioned if the recording has good bass on it, the DI’s truly do a great job and I am more than satisfied with them. But as you say, on more compressed music is where they don’t do the recording any favors in the lower frequency department whereas my other speakers artificially or not seemed to "warm" up those frequencies.
Probably just a trait of the DI’s being so transparent to the "source".
And agreed, cables and interconnects will only help!
@greg22lz Interesting! I will have to try that. I did move them closer to the wall to try to maximize bass reinforcement but I haven't pulled them out any more than 2 feet. Worth a try and it will benefit the overall sound stage as well. Unfortunately I can't post my findings for a week and a half as I'm working out of town.
And one other "tweak" that is worth a shot is my amp taps. I've only just tried the 4 ohms, not the 8 or 16. I'm not convinced that would help anything but it's free. :)
Welcome hfaddict and thanks for sharing your audio experience. I'm thinking Greg is spot on and your bass issue might be recording or room dependent as bass is a strong point of the DI's. As Greg mentioned getting enough bass shouldn't be an issue......but compared to the door rattling bass in so many cars, they might not be what you're used to 😃 Other than the bass your description of the DI's was spot on with my assessment of them..........and you're right, the DI's are very transparent to the source and anything upstream of them. A recording with some good acoustic bass should make you happy 🔉 Thanks again for joining in the conversation here.
Recently sold my LM508IA but it's a great sounding unit and a simple tube swop will take it to a higher level of refinement and sound quality.
- Psvane 805 is an upgrade but TJ Full Music are superior - Emission Labs 300b very dynamic and reliable - Sophia Mesh Plates 300b very organic sounding with texture - Best 6SN7 in this circuit Sylvania WGTA Brown Base - Tung-Sol 6SL7
Since your speakers are so revealing, the Sophia may be the tube to go with and also look into some GIK Acoustic treatment to go behind your speakers and treatment centered between your speakers; Big difference in sound-staging, imaging, bass...
@hfaddict Welcome to the thread and thanks for your wonderful post.
I’m not sure what your personal definition and expectations around bass quality etc "are" so this may or may not work for you: -
- Isolate the speakers...something above and beyond just using the spikes. I use Herbie’s Footers. There are a number of other options and, if interested, I can list more.
- Raise your speakers. If they are on the stock spikes, try inserting a platform / shelf / something diy; then position with the spikes-in to see if you get better results. This is an easy test. If they do you can look at something more specific acoustically and aesthetically.
Et al, I just have to add that the DI's are so detailed that sometimes when I hear some musical aspect, a drum hit, or low background voices, tin startles me. It sounds like it is coming from outside the room. I look around and realize it is coming from the speakers. TOO real! Greg
Hey Greg, yeah, man, I'm amazed with these DIs, and I haven't even got my room treatment in yet. These have tripped me out so far.
Last night I did some critical listening for the first time. Granted, I have a long way to go with my recently gutted dedicated room, but damn, this is what it's all about. I might just skip the whole upgrading to the mini-Ulfs, and roll with these DIs.
Piano sounded real. Like right there in the room "real." Tom Petty started singing and I swear his ghost was right there with me. Now, I was a little lit, but I listened to the same tracks today and they sounded the same...
...and to me, when a speaker can reproduce the lower-mids, even under sub-optimal conditions, that's a sign of some beautiful speakers.
@wig Thank you for the suggestions. I did some research on the TJ and Emissions tubes on the power side. I am also new to tube rolling and always worry about sacrificing one thing for another. EG - bass for high frequency extension. But once the 508 is completely broken in including tubes, then I’ll start exploring some of those tube options. Also thanks for the fuse suggestions.
As for room treatments, I did actually build twelve 2x4 foot hanging sound treatment panels for my HT room, made an amazing difference in that room. Unfortunately in the new house, the front of the listening room will actually be large sliding glass doors. So there will be no treatment allowed there. Lol. The floors are hardwood but we will most likely be using rugs there. Shall be interesting.
@david_ten I will try this out. I've noticed many guys going that route of using risers. I can admit right now one thing that isn't helping my case is the speakers are spiked through the carpet to the concrete but...at least one of the speakers is still wobbly.
You guys have given me great tips on optimizing my set up. Very much appreciated.
I enjoy on occasion those recordings that exploit that bottom octave of music. In my room, the DI's are optimized for a big stereo image and I won't sacrifice that by moving them towards the front wall. Given that, I have very high quality bass that seems very well integrated with the rest of the musical spectrum. But what I don't have is "room lock" say in the 16-32Hz range that I might like. So I suspect some day I will bring in a pair of high quality subs for such occasions. Eric clearly made the right call in voicing this speaker. It is beautifully integrated from top to bottom.
Thick curtains on those reflective sliding doors while listening will reduce early reflections and give better imaging; taming those will open up a new level of transparency.
The LM will get better within the first 2 months and will become even quieter as those massive transformers run-in.
@Hfaddict - Thanks for the feedback on your DIs and showing us your system. Excellent pictures!! Since you have a JL Audio sub available I would at least try it - stick it in the corner where that plant is? :-) I run a REL sub with my Impact Monitors and it doesn't take away from the magic of the Tekton tweeter array as far as I can tell.
@corelli @sbayne I may try a sub in the future. Sounds silly but I just find it hard to justify the use of the a sub when the speakers are so large to start with. It's not the most sane rationale I know...
Speaking of sanity or not, I ran an SVS SB 13 Ultra with my Spatial M3's and thought it integrated very well. As did another owner of Spatial M3's when he was over for a listening night. Open baffle vs boxed sub bass, how dare I. Lol
@wig Just chatted with the wife on having drapes on the sliding doors. She's good with it. As most of us know, it's mostly a balancing act between what we want and the WAF. Unless it's a dedicated room.
I'm already so impressed with this amp. And what a beast. I do now get a touch of hum through the speakers. It's so minimal that I'm not even going to play with the hum adjustment. But these are quite efficient speakers. I probably missed it but what did you replace your LM 508 with?
Funny here!!!! WAF, " wow, they... are.... kind of... well... large...ummm. Then later that evening James Taylor Live double CD is playing and it is so real and engaging that she was tearing up. Next day, " we need to make these blend in.... !!! She loves them!!!
hfaddict I completely agree with your position on the DI'S and compressed music. The wilson line off speakers have made a fortune catering to this weakness. I recently upgraded my system to a T+ A PA 3000 HV and the Aurender A10. I'm not a low tube watt guy every up grade will return big dividends with the DI'S.
I was wondering if someone could elaborate on the DI's pertaining to a 4 ohm vs. 8ohm version of these speakers. I believe I read that some are using 8ohm amps to drive 4 ohm rated speakers. Also, is there a difference in sound between the 2. Thanks much. Sully
Sullyman go to zero Fidelity, you tube , he talks about your questions.he did a good job talking about the DI, He got my attention to audition one.And I am not even looking for speakers....
Well, I've decided to order the SE's. I was half hoping they were only marginally better than the DI's so that I wouldn't have to spend the extra cash.....but it never works out that way in this hobby, does it? 😏
At at least I can move my DI's to my theater system where I can enjoy them with an SS amp while I drive the SE's with my SEP amp. Two....two pair of speakers are better than one ( there's a commercial there somewhere ).
You will not regret getting the SE's, they are a wonderful speaker. I'm equally excited for you getting back your ZOTL and your new "baby" Aric's SET KT-88 amplifier. You owe us a field report regrading this combo, indeed. Also let's no forget your CF hybrid reference DAC driving the whole system!
The room and speakers has you generating some severe modes and nodes. Move the speakers to a new location, and please email me a sketch of your room size and layout. Also is the ceiling flat or vaulted?
We’ve had clients with the best ears in the industry commenting consistently that the DI’s are producing the best ’believable’ bass they’ve ever heard.
Happy listening!
Eric Alexander - audio designer Tektondesign@gmail.com
I know I'll love the SE's teajay. I've loved every pair of Tekton speakers I've owned. The Enzo's and DI's are amazing and I'm ready to be blown away yet again with the SE's. I look forward to sharing my impressions of all of the new toys coming in. My MZ and Aric amp arrive Tuesday! My Sablon digital cable will arrive next week also. It will be a good week.
Hfaddict, take Eric up on his offer and you'll be greatly rewarded. Your room looks great, but could use some help acoustically. As someone mentioned earlier, thick drapes over all that glass will do wonders, along with something on the wall between the speakers. Hell, why am I offering suggestions when you can get the help you need directly from Eric himself?
@tektondesign Very much appreciate the response. I will report back when I’m moved into the new house and have everything tweaked to perfection!
And I just wanted to clarify to everyone what I was trying to get at with the bass now that I understand compressed vs uncompressed recordings a little more.
The bass is terrific on good recordings and that’s coming from a guy who is a bit of a bass head. At any volume level, they deliver it in spades in a clean, powerful manner. Doesn’t matter if it’s blues, folk, live or even hip hop/electronic.
Right now it’s the weaker or compressed recordings that the DI’s don’t artificially pump up the bass like some speakers may. This is leaving some of my classic rock out of the play list currently.
But...in saying this, I will definitely report back in the new listening room. The one opportunity I haven’t had is to spend time with these speakers in another environment or amplification. I had a quick run through a friend’s home on Pass Labs amplification but it was short and sweet before I made the purchase. So I’m not sure exactly what to expect or strive for in my own set up.
Thanks again to everyone for the input. A big part of this hobby for me is playing and tweaking until everything is optimized. It's coming.
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