??? Where Does "High End" Start ???

IME, it starts at whatever point you can finally relax and get off the upgrade train. That requires synergy. It doesn’t matter how much you spend if you don’t have synergy, and a good room in which to place the synergistic gear. 

Starts between your ears! 

A search using AI yielded this:
Entry level:$1000.00 -$4000.00
Mid Fi:$4000.00 - $8000.00
High End:$8000.00- $30,000.00
Ultra High End:$30,000.00 +.....
What do you think?

People misinterpret the meaning of high in high end when in fact it was the people who came up with this stuff who were high.  They even spelled it wrong leaving out 2 whole letters. 
 

High end starts when you start hearing the differences between components and you change a component in search of better quality reproduction..

I have to make the judgement by looking at components. their performance, and quality of construction and then looking at the prices. From this point of view this is what I think:

Consumer level tends to be less than $2K... although for instance Schiit performed better than equivalent boxes that are consumer. 

MidFi probably $2K - $8K+ somewhere. Typically where NAD and Rotel fit in.

Typically entry level high end about $10K... Audio Research just introduced some equipment in the $9K... this is ideal high end entry level. Excellent sound quality built to last decades.  

Mid tier high end $20K - $40K

Upper tier $50K+

Rough... but most of the electronic components I have listened to fall pretty well into this... with some variation. I think over the last couple years the mid-tier moved from $15K to $20K

I'm not sure High End sound fits into strict price lanes.  High end occurs when you hear it. It's when he sound produced exceeds your expectations of what you believed it was supposed to sound like.  Proper synergy between lesser priced components can far exceed the mismatched combination of the more expensive and to be clear all "High-End"  systems don't have to  sound  remotely similar .  What they have are strengths tailored to the ear of the designer / owner.   

My first exposure to "High-end" was at the store at which I worked.  It was Klipsch Corner Horns powered by McIntosh in a fairly large sound room.  The presentation is more like an IMAX theater instead of a no holes bared super resolution photograph.  Both have merit and in my opinion are both high-end.  After years of searching the stars aligned and I was able to have my expectations exceeded and would proudly tell anybody I own a high-end stereo.  I do have a serious investment (relatively speaking)  especially if you add all the components it took to get here but I'm more on the synergistic lower priced scale.

+1 @maprik 

For me, it was a used Audionet Pre1 G3 preamp for about $3500.  It blew away my previous Classe, Parasound, BHK and other PS Audio.  It opened my ears and eyes!

"Where Does High End Start???"

...Just above what you can afford.

high end is not about price it is intention:

if you are building components where features are more important then build quality not high end 

vs components where parts quality and sound quality are paramount you are high end 

it is that simple 

Dave and Troy

Audio Intellect NJ

HEA does not have a specific price point per component because it's the sum of parts not an individual component.

It starts when you figure out what kind of sound you like and are able to match your components so they work well together. If you go by price, you lose. Price can't tell you anything about how a component sounds. For example, if you need 2 components and have a budget of $1000 for each one, that's exactly what you are going to get. 2 components that cost $1000 each. If you know what type of sound you like and know how to select your components, $500 for one and $1500 for the other may be a much better option for you. The more you know, the less you have to spend (within reason). 

@toddain, you have the best answer!  I think the key is not to worry about high/mid/low, but to just enjoy what you have, to learn and explore, and to appreciate the music.  There is always a newer, shinier, object out there. 

audiotroy

high end is not about price it is intention: if you are building components where features are more important then build quality not high end vs components where parts quality and sound quality are paramount you are high end 

+1. 

“High end” isn’t midfi. Full stop.

High end is a state of mind. It’s what thrills you as your nirvana sound. It’s requires effort, time and money. To some a $200K system/room is unnecessary and/or is unthinkable and to some money isn’t the issue.. 

A Bugatti is high end auto in the uppermost price range. A ford Escape is a car in the lower price range. Both will get you around over to the in laws. Now just aplly that thinking to audio, watches, closing and everything. Whatever floats your boat. Toot. Toot. 

When EVERYTHING matters.

I believe some of the responses are trying to simplify the meaning of a true High-End-Audio system(HEA). It is not just what one can afford or good enough for some, certain sonic parameters have to be meet. Since the OP wanted a price structure I will leave the subjective parameters for another thread.

I don't understand people's need to put labels on everything. Or firm definitions.

"What is high end"?

"What is an audiophile"?

"What defines a 'high-performing' car?"

This list can go on and on...

I don't get why soliciting people's opinions, which invariably will be all over the place, further any conversation or provide any actionable knowledge or insight.

@bimmerlover Well, because when people communicate it is a good idea to know definitions of verbiage being used.

I agree with Audiotroy.

Agree with audiotroy and highway61.I also think brand gives you highend taste. Like Krell, Mark Levinson , audio research, Wilson’s, you can buy their product on used market as well. 

@knock1 not when everyone has their own definitions; then it's meaningless. 

There are people who are going to post that HE is a state of mind, that champagne results can be obtained on beer budgets.  However a lot of dosh is spent on this hobby and it is useful to have parameters for discussion.

  The AI definition is reasonable.  Every one that I know in real life would not dream of spending that much

I don't think you can qualify it by price alone. There are 1K tube amps I would rather have in my system than 3K HT receivers. Some mid fi stuff costs more than quality entry level hi fi gear. And when you shop on the used market, that price disparity can become greater.

I don't think it really can classed by MSRP but more by the results obtained. With careful system development and paying attention to everything and how it all works together you can achieve astonishing results. Begin with the end in mind. *Steven Covey 

If it's built to meet a price point, it's low to mid fi.

If it's built to a cost is no object position, it high end.

toddalin

468 posts

08-05-2025 at 08:31pm 

"Where Does High End Start???"

...Just above what you can afford.

Best answer!

What if I identify as HEA?

I can offer 3 system cost data points based on my current gear for consideration:

• in a 12X12 room:  ~ 5k
• in a larger 20X30 L shaped  room:  ~9K  (larger speakers with good build quality)
• in a very large open concept-layout family room sacrificing the lowest bass octave: ~7 k 

Cost is retail price, in 2024 dollars, streamer source, amplification, speakers only.

Note: I am no compromise in sound quality but very value oriented when making buying decisions, so I would say my costs are more representative of the "entry point" for true "high end sound" though I can think of ways to achieve similar results for less with just a touch of compromise regarding the lowest octaves perhaps, and/or going used.

I’d like to see similar data points from others in order to help folks reach a valid conclusion based on actual data points.

Well looking at some of the speakers for sale here,I woul think you better start with speakers costing at least $100,000....So with that said probably about $200K...That leaves me out.

@limomangus we need talk. 

Remember that high end components that are mismatched do not deliver high end sound.  Cost and sound quality are 2 different yet related things.

I have a $12k 300wpc Krell and a $2k 6wpc Decware.  The Decware outperforms the Krell hands down. High end is not a price, it’s performance. 

@freediver 

A search using AI yielded this:
Entry level:$1000.00 -$4000.00
Mid Fi:$4000.00 - $8000.00
High End:$8000.00- $30,000.00
Ultra High End:$30,000.00 +.....
What do you think?

AI doesn't have ears!

And if "its" is even close then I'm over the "Ultra High End" by 3-4 fold! which includes room and a true full range system with four Pass Labs amps never operating out of class A. This is where it ends not starts for me.

Regards,

barts

When there’s dust in your wallet, an your divorced

Cheers 

An interesting question with no answer. @gruvjet may have nailed it with big bucks v wise choice.

@mapman “Cost and sound… two different things”. Spot on Man…..

My take….

Hi-end does not have a verifiable point or origin for its existence.

Do not let yourself think your system is high-end simply because of a perceived value.

It is a figment of the imagination to put a “value” on it. If you do, you may be just fooling yourself.

The only evaluation that makes any sense is… does it definitely sound better than low-end?

AGAIN A QUESTION.. Who would claim to know where exactly low-end fades into high-end?

Getting into the mid-end debate certainly then clouds the water even more….

Just labelling a piece of equipment as high-end is no guarantee it is. Be very sceptical if this term is offered up by a manufacturer, retailer or Mr. Nextdoor selling his gear.

Take solace in the fact that it’s a totally subjective determination so if you think it is then it is and vice versa. 

Of course, then there is always what the other guy listening thinks but who cares about what other people think?   Trust your ears, right?

It's simple.

If a system costs less than $35,607 it is lo-fi.

If a system costs more than $35,607 it is hi-fi.

If a system costs exactly $35,607 (including tax) it is mid-fi.

If you look at the top most expensive systems on here or other "extreme" audiophile hang-outs (god help you if it’s WBF), you’ll quickly find that even $5K per component is considered very cheap. 

"Performance" is a different matter and a whole ’nother can of worms. But I’d say that "normal high end" these days - loosely defined as some unquantifiable aggregate of: performance, build quality, aesthetic, esoteric factor, desirability, price, and brand cache - is going to start at ~25K per component and 50K for speakers. That’s not even "ultra" high-end, not even close. It gets more expensive each year; kind of nuts at this point. Definitely not sustainable.

Maybe rephrase the question 

What is the cost of admission to officially join the elite high end audio club? 
 

Some even accept riffraff like me so don’t give up hope!

Putting a dollar value on it is not an objective measure. Listen to many systems at all price points, develop your listening and evaluation skills. Hearing systems that appeal to you, try to replicate that at home, once you've reached your goal you're on the mountain top. 

There’s no set definition for "high end", and I’m sure it varies by person and is somewhat relative.  To me high end isn’t a focus on a price point....it’s an attitude and philosophy that requires a commitment to make the best you know how, but price understandably tends to be a part of that.   

Big conglomerates buying up smaller companies trying to tap into the profits of the more expensive end of the market, while cheapening as many parts as they can to increase profit is not indicative of how I perceive a true high end approach.  They’re just expensive pretenders.  The true contenders are the businesses that have a real passion for making the best they can that push the envelope of true state of the art. .  

high end is not about price it is intention

Exactly.

MidFi probably $2K - $8K+ somewhere. Typically where NAD and Rotel fit in.

@ghdprentice why, you are certainly in a generous mood today! The only place NAD fits in is the trash, and only if the can is large enough 😂

I'm not sure about a dollar value but for me on my system it's when I play an album that I have heard many times and think to myself God that sounds absolutely fantastic. 

So exactly how do we define these terms in absolutes?

This is subjective and not an absolute, getting additional opinions may give you a probability range, but it won’t lead to a definitive absolute. My definition of High-End Audio is simply seeking out Sonics above what is available in the mainstream consumer market.  

@freediver    Most of the posters believe there is no specific price point per component or complete system, the others are making a poor attempt at comic relief. A better question might be... What sonic parameters are required to attain a true High End Audio (HEA) system? 

The other day I was wondering "what are the properties of an audio system that make it 'High End'".

I don't think it is a matter of price, though there is some floor.  For example an Eversolo DMP A8 and a carefully chosen pair of Dynaudio Active speakers probably gives one some of the qualities that we value for $5k.

For me the to critical qualities are timbre/tonality - does it sound right, resolution - can you hear into the performance and can you hear the the music in the very quiet passages.  Do you hear the "performance", the shape of the notes, the harmonics, the decays, the subtle changes in loudness?

A high end system will also have a clear soundstage, a clear sense of where the instruments & performers are.

I have two systems, the 2nd system cost perhaps 8k, and makes wonderful music, the primary system makes the music more complete, and the sense of being at the performance much greater - albeit at over 10x the cost.

I have a very musical friend who will have nothing to do with "high end", he listens to his "hi-fi" all the time, but I do not find it a satisfying experience, there is no sense of the performance.

Absolute? The point at which your significant other gets really p*ssed at your most recent purchase.

+1 @gruvjet 

Stop making sense… it confuses them…

A better questions would be, how much one is willing to shed for Hifidality Audio reproduction? Hifidelity audio, or Hi-Fi, refers to the high-quality reproduction of sound. It aims to recreate the original recording as accurately as possible, with minimal noise and distortion, and a faithful representation of the full range of audible frequencies. It’s a term popular with audiophiles and home audio enthusiasts who appreciate a detailed, immersive, and emotionally engaging listening experience

Based on your listening habits, you can decided the price point where you are satisfied with the music you are hearing. Does it really matter how much you spend to get that sound quality? I don't think so. All other categories from entry level to low-fi, mid-fi, etc., are irrelevant. Amount one can spend on this hobby will depend on many factors. What matters is whether your audio system reproduce Hi-Fi music to your satisfaction at whatever price point you are comfortable.